Can anyone tell me about the UN

by PoppyR 14 Replies latest watchtower scandals

  • PoppyR
    PoppyR

    Hi! I'm so sorry that I'm sure everytime somone new joins you're going over the same thing again, but all this is VERY new to me, in fact I've done very little this past week except read articles and cross reference the WT cd rom..lol, everyone thinks I'm getting spiritual again, anyway!

    I have read several references to the JWs and the UN.. can anyone shed some light on the matter, ie point me in the direction of good posts or articles about it, as I'm still unclear what has been going on. I'm most interested in the facts of the case which is what I think this board is best at!

    Thanks in advance!

    Poppy x

  • anglise
    anglise



    Here are copies of the UK Guardian articles.



    Hope it is OK to post these.

    Jehovah's Witnesses link to UN queried

    Sect accused of hypocrisy over association with organisation it has demonised.

    Stephen Bates, religious affairs correspondent
    Monday October 8, 2001
    The Guardian
    The United Nations is being asked to investigate why it has granted associate status to the Jehovah's Witnesses, the fundamentalist US-based Christian sect, which regards it as the scarlet beast predicted in the Book of Revelation.

    Disaffected members of the 6m-strong group, which has 130,000 followers in the UK, have accused the Witnesses' elderly governing body of hypocrisy in secretly accepting links with an organisation that they continue to denounce in apocalyptic terms.

    The UN itself admitted yesterday that it was surprised that the sect, whose formal name is the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York, had been accepted on its list of non-governmental organisations for the last 10 years.

    A former member said: "There is a glaring inconsistency which has emerged between the WTBTS's frequent portrayal of the UN as an evil organisation and its behind-the-scenes attempts to curry favour with that organisation. Were individual members to be aware of any formal link they would be devastated.

    "By no stretch of the imagination could the WTBTS be considered to share the ideals of the UN charter unless you suppose that destruction of the UN by God is consistent with that charter."

    The Witnesses, most frequently encountered by non-members when they attempt to make doorstep conversions, have faced accusations of bad faith before.

    These have been most notably over the hierarchy's insistence that members should not accept blood transfusions and over accusations that sexual abuse of children by Witnesses' ministers in the US have been covered up.

    Followers who criticise the Witnesses' leaders or question their decisions are routinely "disfellowshipped" which means fellow members including their families must shun them.

    An obscure and ill-publicised decision by the hierarchy in New York last year modifying the prohibition on transfusions by deeming that God had revealed to them that transfusions of some blood components might be acceptable, providing there was later repentance, has come too late for many hundreds of followers known to have died because they refused blood.

    In child abuse cases, the hierarchy insists there must be two independent witnesses - an almost impossible stipulation - before accusations are investigated.

    The Watchtower Society has been denouncing the UN and its predecessor the League of Nations for 80 years, believing them to be a world empire of false religion, predicted in the Book of Revelation.

    A recent publication since the organisation obtained its recognition describes the UN as "a disgusting thing in the sight of God and his people".

    In an internal document, the WTBTS describes its policy as a "theocratic war strategy". It claims: "In time of spiritual warfare it is proper to misdirect the enemy by hiding the truth. It is done unselfishly; it does not harm anyone; on the contrary it does much good."

    Being a recognised NGO with the United Nations - as more than 1,500 organisations are - gives status though not grants.

    To qualify, organisations must show that they share the ideals of the charter, operate on a non-profit basis, "demonstrate interest in UN issues and proven ability to reach large or specialised audiences" and have the commitment and means to conduct effective information programmes about UN activities.

    Disaffected Witnesses believe that the association, which has not been publicised to followers, is intended to increase the cult's respectability to sceptical governments, such as France's, which have refused to recognise it.

    Paul Gillies, the Witnesses' spokesman in Britain, said: "We do not have hostile attitudes to governing bodies and if we are making representations on issues to the UN we will do so."

    "There are good and bad bodies just as there are good and bad politicians. We believe what the Book of Revelation tells us but we do not actively try to change the political system."

    A spokeswoman for the UN said: "I think we may not be aware of their attitude, which seems to be really strange."



    Special report
    Religion in the UK

    'Hypocrite' Jehovah's Witnesses abandon secret link with UN


    Stephen Bates, religious affairs correspondent

    Monday October 15, 2001

    The Guardian




    The Jehovah's Witnesses have hurriedly disaffiliated from the United Nations within days of a Guardian story in which members accused the sect of hypocrisy for supporting an organisation it has repeatedly denounced privately.

    After the article last Monday, the organisation's New York based hierarchy pre-empted a UN inquiry by agreeing to dissociate the Witnesses from an organisation which it holds to be the scarlet beast named in the Book of Revelation.

    The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York, as the sect is formally known, has 6m members worldwide and 130,000 in Britain. It had been secretly affiliated to the UN as a non-governmental organisation for 10 years.

    Recognised organisations are supposed to demonstrate that they share the UN's objectives, but Witnesses are instead told by elders to regard it as "a disgusting thing in the sight of God and his people" for allegedly aspiring to world domination like Babylon the Great, the beast in Revelation.

    The sect does not believe in participating in government and initially strove to play down or deny the evidence of the UN's website, which lists it as one of 1,500 affiliated NGOs.

    Those bringing the evidence to light were accused of apostacy. Disaffiliated members become known informally, like the rest of humanity, as "bird seed" in line with biblical prophesy of the fate of non-believers, whose corpses will be pecked bare by crows.

    Within hours of the article's appearance on the Guardian website on Monday and its posting on a Jehovah's Witnesses bulletin board, more than 14,000 people across the world had read it.

    By yesterday there were 353 official posts and 325 message boards discussing the article and its revelations, with Witnesses in the US demanding to see copies of the paper.




    Special report

    Religion in the UK

  • Oroborus21
    Oroborus21


    PoppyR,

    It's a minor scandal/major embarrassment which opposers of Jehovah's Witnesses are gleefully pushing as a "smoking gun" of "Watchtower apostacy," "double-standards", ad nauseum.

    Opposers would have people believe that the UN Scandal is the equivalent of the WTS getting in bed with the U.N. and carrying on in an intimate relationship of support and backing when it is NOTHING like that at all.

    In reality all it really amounts to is no one in authority pausing to think about the implications and "how it looks" for the Society to be an official NGO member of the U.N., regardless of the supposed reasons.

    After the Society got caught in this questionable status, they made the mistake of compounding the error with half-truths, lies and cover-ups which has only fueled the fire and made the whole thing look even worse than it actually is.

    It's like the actions of the Nixon administration (which were major crimes) after the rather minor crime (relatively) of the actual Watergate break-in by some bumbling nobody underlings.

    There are only two truly significant things that arose out of the whole UN Scandla.

    First, is that it proved for the first time the power of the Internet among the Organization in our modern climate because literallly 1 or 2 days after the story broke on the Internet and the inquiries began to fly, the Society asked the U.N. to withdraw its NGO membership.

    And second it revealed the disconnect between the messages sent to the audience, the Worldwide Association, and those responsible for creating the message. This later facet is probably something which has been developing at the top of the Org ever since Fred Franz died and there hasn't been any one person with the power and the will to look at the global communication emanating from the Tower and shape it into a cohesiveness. This is why for the last couple of decades the Society's messages have devolved into a whole scattered multi-cultural hodgepodge that just seems completely impotent of any motivating force. This is also why now there is simply nothing "new" being generated by the current leadership and all that is being done is repetitive regurgitation of the same info, messages and communication.

    -Eduardo Leaton Jr., Esq.

  • Cygnus
    Cygnus

    Bob King does a pretty good job briefly (albeit from a harsh biblical standpoint) here: http://www.jehovah-has-become-king.com/forward.html

    A few years ago when the story first broke, Hyghlandyr and I would give out the UN webpage that listed the WTS as an NGO to the JW yahoo chat room. We or some other "apostate" were accused of hacking the UN website and listing the Watchtower Society, or that the entire website was a forgery by gnashing teethed apostates.

  • Legolas
  • AK - Jeff
    AK - Jeff

    Poppy - Pay no attention to those who say things like it being a 'minor issue'. The letter of aggrement between the UN and NGO's states emphatically that the NGO [Watchtower Society] must agree with the principles of the UN CHarter and support her by publishing favorable articles, etc. Legolas gave you all the links. I would start to prove it to myself this way; Go to the official UN website; www.un.org Hit the search button and type 'watchtower'. Then follow some of the links that Legolas listed, or do a Google search. Pick your jaw up off the floor and start thanking God that he has shown you the true face of the organization. That's what I did. Jeff

  • Cygnus
    Cygnus

    Legolas, el oh el, I'd say that's a pretty definitive and comprehensive resource.

  • AK - Jeff
    AK - Jeff

    Another thread now active on the same issues -

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/8/99993/1.ashx

  • AuldSoul
    AuldSoul

    PoppyR, the Christian Congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses does not outrightly state that they had no knowledge of the Criteria for Association, but they couch it deeply enough that the average publisher and elder are going to look at that point and go, "So what?"

    The really big issue here is that it violated the Governing Body's own judgments even if the Criteria for Association did not exist. They JOINED the UN/DPI.

    The CCoJW couldn't be more pleased at apostates chasing down what agreeing to the Criteria meant. They have already stopped the relationship (which they CALL a "registration") and those who would accuse of apostasy on that basis forget that as long as they cannot concretely prove the WTS knew about the Criteria prior to their request for disassociation, no case could be judged under the Governing Body's published standards.

    However, there is still this issue of what the actual nature of the relationship was. They say it was a registration, but it is easily proven that they knew it was an association (i.e. a membership). 1) they applied for it, you don't apply for registration you just sign up, 2) there was a review and approval process of three to six weeks, I know of no registration with similar constraints, 3) they became Accredited to the UN/DPI, when do you get credentials for registering for something, 4) there was a yearly review process for determining whether to retain an organization as an Accredited Associate through the year 2000 (this changed to a every four years review in 2002), what kind of registration requires that level of continued interaction?

    So, it is easy to prove that they knew they were an Accredited NGO Associated to the UN/DPI (i.e. the mouthpiece of the UN, its voice). Why is that important? Because Organized to Accomplish Our Ministry (published 1983, 1989 p. 151) says:

    Concerning those who renounced their Christian faith in his day, the apostle John wrote: “They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of our sort, they would have remained with us.” (1 John 2:19) Also, a person might renounce his place in the Christian congregation by his actions, such as by becoming part of a secular organization the objective of which is contrary to the Bible and, hence, is under judgment by Jehovah God. (Compare Revelation 19:17-21; Isaiah 2:4) So if a person who is a Christian chooses to join those who are disapproved by God, it would be fitting for the congregation to acknowledge by a brief announcement that he has disassociated himself and is no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses. Such a person would be viewed in the same way as a disfellowshipped person.

    The view has not changed a bit. Organized to Do Jehovah's Will (published 2005 p. 155) says:

    Concerning those who renounced their Christian faith in his day, the apostle John wrote: “They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of our sort, they would have remained with us.” (1 John 2:19) For example, a person might renounce his place in the Christian congregation by his actions, such as by becoming part of a secular organization that has objectives contrary to the Bible and, hence, is under judgment by Jehovah God. (Isa. 2:4; Rev. 19:17-21) If a person who is a Christian chooses to join those who are disapproved by God, a brief announcement is made to the congregation, stating: “[Name of person] is no longer one of Jehovah’s Witnesses.” Such a person is treated in the same way as a disfellowshipped person. The presiding overseer should approve this announcement.

    While accusations relative to the Criteria for Association can be lost in a game of semantics, this one is rock solid and inescapable:

    1) Is the UN/DPI an organization?

    2) Does the UN/DPI have objectives contrary to the Bible?

    3) While the WTS could not become part of the UN, did they become part of the UN/DPI?

    4) Did they do so by their own choice?

    Once you answer these honestly, all that is left is to read the judgment they pronounce on themselves.

    AuldSoul

  • gumby
    gumby

    Nice job AuldSoul.

    The fact that they "quickly" took their name off the list as members when they were exposed.....should put up red flags for anyone. If they had nothing to hide....they would have remained members.

    Gumby

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