by LeftBehind 128 Replies latest jw friends
"Coming back to Jehovah?"
Oh, please. Some of us never left him. It's just that some of us don't need the Watchtower, Bible and Bull Shit Society to tell us how to have a relationship with him. Just because you can't figure it out doesn't mean that the rest of us can't.
BTW, I knew you'd be back.
Honey, you sound like a smart girl and a caring sister. Your brother is also the same. He cares about his family, but he does not choose to be led by words printed by an organization. He is making his own way and appears to be doing just fine. You would benefit from taking a break, finding some space for yourself....I am a mom of 3 adult kids, and believe me, I know, sometimes we all need space to have a little soul searching. Light a little candle and pray to Jehovah to truly come into your heart; ask him to help you see your brother in the way that Jesus taught us, to Love one another as He has loved us. It's pretty simple. The bible is a great tool, but the JW's have changed many of the words to reflect their teachings, did you know that? If the Bible was written to save us all, why do only JWs have their special version and it is not available to anyone unless they follow the Watchtower Society? Christians can buy a Bible at Walmart and pray together; but JW's, who say they are Christian, choose to stay apart and pray as the Pharisees did, judging the others.
Sorry to ramble, but there is so much hurt from this...please take a little breather from meetings, etc. and find the love of Jehovah inside yourself.
Peace,
AuntieJ
LeftBehind- (I am really hoping you bother reading all I have to say. You asked a question and I have a very busy life and I chose to stay up late and give you my version of an answer. So I really hope you take the time to read something that I took so much time from my work to write..I will be respectful, I promise)
I read your first post and wanted to reply. I felt how hurt you are and I see so much in your short paragraph that stirs emotions on so many levels. So let me sart by saying I think you are very brave to post here and actually ask some questions AND even braver yet for reaching outside the JW norm and bothering to go in a round about way to the source and look for answers. You have come to the source of the hurt and are asking questions.
There are a lot of answers and varying opinions here. It is your choice to actually listen and take the answers at face value, or you can turn a deaf ear and listen to what the Governing Body will have to say about all of these opinions and lives. That is that we are led astray, not submissive, under Satans influence...etc.
Think about it and when you are asked a question and someone jumps in and speaks for you it can be really annoying. It may not be at all how you feel, or even close to the situation. Even as a witness I know I was taught to go straight to the source for an answer. Research, etc. But that was all via JW material. I highly suggest you go to the source of the documentation people here have provided for you. Non "apostate" sites, books etc.
It may be very hard for you because you have been taught that if the information does not agree with the organization, that it is apostate. That in itself should make you think. You know the organization did not make up the Bible, but they interpret it. They say it is not an interpretation, but honey, it is. That was the hardest thing for me to accept, that I had been taught an interpretation. One of many interpretaions that were out there. Just think on that.
People who leave the organization are not all evil, they are not all debased, and they do not all do drugs, booze it up, fornicate and such. Some do, some don't. That is something else to keep in mind. There are many loving families here. They do not live bad lives, they just actually have started living. They have learned to have an opinion and they have learned to balance things. Education, skill sets, and actually living a clean life are main priorities for many.
You have been taught that your actions teach more than anything. These disfellowshipped, disassociated, apostate people do amazing things that move proverbial mountains, and it is all in the actions. Yes they are hurt, yes we all go through a crazy time when we loose everything, but I think you will find most do not want to go back. They miss families, they get depressed, they act out, they cry and laugh just the same as they ever did. They still love, they still live and breath. They area not dead and usually are more alive and aware of the world plight and peoples needs more than they ever were. They have looked in the mirror and had humbling experience. They have faced the worst fear many of us have and that is seeing the truth about ourselves.
It is hard to see that you were perhaps once misled. That you were lied to, that the family you left behind are firm believers in things based on lies. (Please do not stop reading) It is true, we were taught to base our lives and loves and families on things that were covered over. THAT is very hard to accept. It is hard to accept that many of us were self rightious and shunned others. We did this being rightiously indignant in our own right. This indignation was OK, because after all the ones we shunned were apostate, or had "left Jehovah."
But here we sit now and being in the same boat and having researched and seen things that nobody can remove from our sight and our ears, we have had to see that that is a horrible thing to do. It really hurts and is embarrasing, humbling and all together a very heartwrenching thing to go through. To see how alone we one left people we loved and left them alone. We caused them so much pain by not talking to them, by shunning, by being so self rightious. We went door to door and preached how Jesus loved all and ate with harlots and how he led the way, and yet we left that sheep behind. JUST AS WE WERE TAUGHT NOT TO. Just as we were taught to.
It is like we read it, preached it, lived it, and yet missed the whole point.
I am sure your brother loves you and misses you. He is a very strong person for staying away and calling himself apostate. But think about it....in all actuality he is like Jesus himself demonstrated and is standing up for what he believes and is not denying the truth in what he sees. He is in the so called Temple gates and is calling out for all to see that there is something really wrong with the 'temple'. That takes some guts.
I think you should call him. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow. Take some time and actually research for yourself so that when you talk, you do not get mad at all he says, and you will be more prepared to not offend him. It is another very humbling thing to find out how offensive we were as witnesses. We are taught that we are different and stand out and we whow others the way as JW's, but the fact is that we really were offensive. NOT hated because of our faith in God, but possibly pitied by others who saw a lot that we were taught not to see. We could not see ourselves.
In answer to your question, I would not go back. I am not even sure how I feel about God. I do not join any organized religion. I went back twice and it is amazing that all these people I love so much don't even blink an eye at me. I raised their children with them, we ate at each others table, gave birth, experienced death, worshiped and loved, and yet they NEVER question what really happened to me. They accept the answer read by another human who is not even family from a platform and they WALKED AWAY.
All these people loved me and yet they did not think twice about what it would really take to get my life back on track. Instead of going the extra mile, they closed the door, and shook heads, and they woke up and went door to door and tried to teach people how to love. I have three kids and there is no way..no way that I could do that to them. No matter what choices they make. I could not disown them, write them off for making mistakes. Not once, not 100 times, not 70 x 70. Because they are human and the mistakes will NEVER stop. My mistakes will never stop and how in the world, if a sin is a sin can I EVER judge anyone, shun, disfellowship, turn away and not talk to anyone, especially my own child for something I do daily.
I could not, I won't. I wish for you strength in you search, and I really hope that you too take a look in that mirror. Honestly. It is a painful journey, but well worth the work. You may just find your brother will be right by you. You may find he is not dead. You may find he is right.
I would never go back. The factual reasons are many. These are just some facts:
I would never go back. The Paradise and Armageddon thing is no more real than Santa Claus. But you wouldn't know that unless you actually look at other bible translations - which JWs never do. They are convinced their New World Translation is the best.
The only difference between Santa Claus and the JW's Jehovah is that Santa Claus isn't going to slaughter 6 billion people.
Thanks,
-ithinkisee
I will never go back to the organisation. A lot of us left because we finally saw how hypocritical the organisation was. A lot of us never left God (probably actually found him for the first time) But leaving the organisation to a JW is tantamount to leaving God.
Welcome back LB you have surprised me and impressed me with your return; many simply hit and run which to be honest is sometimes frustrating.
Sorry to hear about your brother; you must feel very conflicted at present and thats understandable; my advice however is to use this time you have with him to try and establish some semblence of relationship with him.
Jesus would never have rejected his brother! an apostle who wasnt even his fleshly brother denied Jesus three times and did Jesus reject him? NO!
Apostasy as interpreted by Jehovahs Witnesses is not really apostasy at all; simply rejecting the organisation is not simply rejecting God; more must be done in order to reject your creator; from what you have written it seems that his so called apostasy is actually seeing faults in the organisation but why should the faults be ignored? Why shouldnt he speak out about what he sees? It wasnt wrong for Jesus to speak out at the temple and it wasnt wrong for Jesus to take action.
His research on the internet was also not wrong how could research be possibly wrong in Jehovahs eyes; wasnt it in the bible where you are encouraged to 'test Jehovah'; if you believe Jehovah is working through the organisation then test it...see whether or not it is good. If the society has nothing to hide why try to prevent their followers from researching on the internet...which in effect is a glorified library; would it be wrong to go to the worlds largest library to research?
It isnt wrong to research different sources and in my view discouraging its members from researching the internet is insulting their intelligence...surely they should be able to judge for themselves what is a reliable source of information and what is not; also too how wrong is it to consider different viewpoints? Surely just researching one interpretation or exploring one avenue of research is highly restrictive unless of course someone has an interest in ensuring you believe their viewpoint. Worth thinking about.
Personally I think the WTBTS is corrupt; no organisation operating as Jehovahs channel would defend child molesters (and yes they are currently doing so) they wouldnt hide child molesters behind the shroud of clergy! privilege (especially so as they suggest they are not part of the clergy). They would not have double standards (which is evident in their association with 'the disgusting thing' mentioned in Revelation)
They would not adopt unchristlike measures to ensuring their followers stay in line; they would not seperate children from their parents just because one child or parent doesnt believe. They wouldnt hinder the academic choices of young people by suggesting that higher education is wrong..(which is exactly what they do do). With Jehovahs blessing they would not have to keep changing their views or consideration of new light issues such as the 1914 generation debacle.
All these things and more keep me away from not only Jehovahs Witnesses but organised religion on the whole.
DB74
I sinned. But instead of hating me, if they had love bombed me and helped me I would never have stiffened my neck so to speak. I would have repented.
I guess the shunning is their way of helping to show how serious the sin is.
What happened to you that made you leave?
1. Seeing the issue of child abuse swept under the rug. Seeing the victims threatened with disfellowshipping if they talked. Requiring TWO WITNESSES to child abuse before it is taken seriously. Seeing a convicted child abuser welcomed back from JAIL into the same congregation as his 4-year-old victim, over the protests of the girl's parents, and the elders telling people they were not allowed to discuss the matter, thereby putting MY CHILDREN at risk until a kind person warned me about him.
2. Seeing that same congregation treat my father, an elder for 40 years, like a pariah because of one mistake, which he was sorry for. He committed suicide because of their hard, callous treatment.
3. Seeing my congregation ignore my child when I brought him to the meeting in a wheelchair for the first time.
4. Reading Jesus' words about "loving your neighbor as yourself" and "by their works you will know my disciples" and comparing those words to the above.
NOTHING will get me back. If this was Jehovah's organization once upon a time, it is no longer. Like the early Christian congregation, it is full of corruption, hypocrisy and Pharasaic rules that put heavy loads on its members.
If living forever hinges on being with those people, fuggedaboudit. I'll enjoy every moment of every day that I have right now and be very grateful for those moments.
Nina
It is my whole-souled dedicated decision to never worship the god of the Hebrews, as he is distasteful to me, and I am 99.9999999999% he does not exist. If he does exist he is among a pantheon of other (competing?) gods. I find there to be much satisfaction in devoting my time to learning what other people speculate on. When I quit being a JW, I dabbled in various forms of christianity and other theistic ideas and came to the conclusion they are not true. Thomas Paine's "The Age of Reason",an old book, was one of my first steps towards critical thinking. I find it is better and wiser (and often fun) to accept that we just don't know much of the esoteric and much of it is mere guesswork. I believe strongly that family and friends are what we're supposed to cherish, not any invisible men in the sky. Life is too short to waste on people wrapped up in rules that command them to drop you in an instant - without even knowing why. Make peace with your brother while you still can, please. We don't want to die but we do and will, and in the short time we inhabit this planet we should be happy. Happiness, true happiness, enduring happines, mental and emotional, is fleeting, and is not to be found in the religion of Jehovah's Witnesses.
I never left him - I left a man-made organization but not Jehovah
