the big question I have do you know if he is baptized?
Hi ~ new here...
by Riverwatcher 33 Replies latest jw friends
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drew sagan
I think I have a good understanding of your situation because I have been (kind of) in the same situation as your son. I got involved at the young age of 17. I got baptized and eventually married another JW. My mother wasn't very happy about my decision to joing the religion, but she let me do it anyway.
Your son will never shun you if he is the type of person that holds his own personal values higher than any particular organization. Personally, I NEVER EVER EVER even thought of "leaving" my family or "cutting off ties". I still went to all of thier holiday parties and never made myself an outsider. This was a personal choice I made because I felt that keeping myslef apart of the family was more important.
The problem is that sometimes when an individual gets involved in the Watchtower they can go overboard. Hence people who shun family and only spend time with their Witness friends. If your son hasn't cut off ties with you after two years, I think it's safe to say that he's not going to do it any time soon. There is no real "timeline".
I think the best thing for you to do is study up on the religion. Read some of the books published by the Watchtower, and get a good sense of what they belive. After doing this I would encourage you to read some books that look at the Watchtower critically. Raymond Franzs books are the best out there in my opinion. They will help you see just what is going on in your sons mind.
Take it slow. You may want to start asking him questions in honest sincerity simply to know what the JW's believe, ect.... Remember that JW's are not supposed to cut off their family from listening to the "good news". If you show yourself interested in what he is talking about, he will be more inclined to talk to you. By reading Rays books, you will be able insert questions into your discussions that will make him think. Take your time, don't move to fast. Don't start telling him he is wrong. Simply ask the questions that make him think and move on.
This may take months or even years, but I think that eventually you will be able to win over your son. More than anything take it slow and show yourself to be patient and kind. Good luck to you! -
IronClaw
Welcome to the board. Im kinda new myself. This board has been a great asset to me, and Im sure it will be to you also. Many of us here are former JW's. Most of us know quite a bit of there doctrine. Pro and Con. One thing for sure: You will always get an answer to your questions. Welcome again.
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Riverwatcher
Serendipity, I don't know how devout he is, to be honest. I can tell you that last year, when I wished him a Happy Thanksgiving, his reply was "mmm". And a few days later, he was talking to his sister on her birthday, and she said to him "so, are you going to wish me a Happy Birthday?", to which he replied "you know I can't do that". So yes, I suppose he's "acting" devout, but what's in his heart is unknown at this point; could be just going through the motions. I don't know if he's baptized or not.
As for him wanting to join just to please his wife, well, this may be part of it. But I think there's more to that story. I think he was "ripe for the picking", so to speak. He was young when he married, only 19, and up until that point in his life had lived with us. A few months prior to his then girlfriend getting pregnant, my husband and myself had made plans to relocate. Of course, our daughter (who still lives at home) and our son would move with us. But then, with the unexpected, unplanned pregnancy, and the wedding that followed, I really do believe our son was sort of like a fish out of water. Huge changes for a young person; suddenly married and soon to be a father. Top that off with your family moving away, and well...it just seems like the J/W's swooped in and presented something that probably sounded pretty darn good to him, considering the circumstances he was now in.
You know, I just want him to be happy. And, as mentioned before, my concern for my Grandbaby is paramount. I can't imagine growing up a J/W. I have such a difficult time with the "us verses them" mentality. I just don't see how anyone could live a productive, happy life feeling like the rest of the world is something to be feared, judged, or avoided. How exhausting that must be! How can there be any joy in a life like that? Is feeling joy something the J/W's strive for in this life, or is that something that they're not going to see until "paradise"?
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AlmostAtheist
I can't imagine growing up a J/W. I have such a difficult time with the "us verses them" mentality. I just don't see how anyone could live a productive, happy life feeling like the rest of the world is something to be feared, judged, or avoided. How exhausting that must be! How can there be any joy in a life like that? Is feeling joy something the J/W's strive for in this life, or is that something that they're not going to see until "paradise"?
Forgive any perception of "praise bombing" please, but you really seem to grasp the whole JW thing. No, it isn't possible to be a strong, sincere JW -AND- live a happy, productive life. One simply precludes the other.
It isn't at all unusual to hear a JW deride some "worldly" person because of his possessions ("He's materialistic") then turn around and talk about the grand home he'll build in the "New System". It seems that materialism is only bad this side of Armageddon. After that, all bets are off!
JW's are constantly told that they are the happiest people on earth. They hear it at the meetings, the assemblies, they say it to each other. They believe they are happy, which raises the question, "Is it possible to only THINK you're happy?" After all, happiness is a state of mind, right? Without any ability to explain it, I believe that yes, you can only THINK you're happy. I did, and I can see now that I wasn't. (That doesn't even make sense to me, but I still stand by it!)
Dave
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Es
welcome to the board.
Perhaps maybe get your son to look at this site, give him some insight as to what really goes on. But perhaps leave it till he brings it up. Mouthy made a good point of never discussing the religion this may help at times.
Sorry you have to go through this, there is alot of support here.
es
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TMS
{QUOTE}"Go to the hall with him. He will just be ecstatic! Meet the folks at the hall. Ask them about their personal lives. Don't let them put you in a charicature. He will try to get you to start a study, try to avoid that!{/QUOTE}
Riverwatcher,
The above is very good advice, although difficult to pull off. If you were able to make an appearance at the Kingdom Hall without divulging your true feelings, it would enhance your position immeasurably. The elders and others of the young couples' peer group would have difficulty painting you as evil. Someone viewed as a potential convert gets the very best from Jehovah's Witnesses.
You are just buying time for your son to wake up of his own volition. There is no other way for him to do that. No rational argument, threat of disinheritance, criticism of his choice of spouse and her parents, etc. will do nothing but solidify his stance.
It's going to be a long haul. Good luck!
tms
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ocsrf
Dear Riverwatch,
Let me share some good news for you!
I have friends who have "wordly" parents, they have always stayed in touch with them and take trips with them and to see them. They LOVE them and wish only good things for those parents. You can sort of give your son a place to go that is not full of JWism when he needs that. The key is to let him come to this on his own, he may stay a witness forever, but he will always love you. I think your kindness to your daughter in law will never be forgotten and create a special bond between you to; however, please be sure not to sound like an apostate when talking with them, by this I mean, as you learn things on this board and others you will learn things that JWs don't know to much about, and if you bring those things up to loudly or to often you will be labeled bad association.
Your grandkids will also LOVE you especially if you are a kindly person, which you seem to be. I know of plenty of grandkids who travel to see "wordly" grandparents, your son may even allow you to give Christmas gifts to them, although I would be careful about ever taking them to a church service, this would really set them off. I have wordly aunts and uncles and really love them, wish I could of spent more time with them. The upside to your grandkids being raised as a witness is that for the most part they will be taught to be respectful, this of course does not happen with all the young ones but it is taught and encouraged.
I know this is not what you would of wanted for your son, but, I have learned as well in my life is that your kids grow up and make their own decisions about things and not all of them are ones we would have like to see them make.
Hang in there, and hopefully you will see that you can still have a close relationship with your son and daughter in law and grand babies.
Sincerely,
OC
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Check_Your_Premises
RW,
Looks like you have been given a broad range of advice and info. You have a lot to chew on. Be sure to give us an update in a couple of weeks or so.
CYP
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anewme
Welcome Riverwatcher!
I got dfd and married a young man whose mother reminds me of you. She, like you, is very smart and very loving.
I too have started the reinstatement process to recoup some of my side of the family.
It is a personal journey for me.
But I will NEVER FORGET THE LOVE AND HELP I RECEIVED AT THE LOWEST TIME OF MY LIFE FROM BOTH MY NOW HUSBAND AND HIS NON-JW MOTHER!
She was alarmed at first and worried, but continues to show the same love and support even now that I am returning. She expresses concern that they treat me excellently. She has even expressed she would like to attend a meeting to make sure they are treating me respectfully as I deserve. (This I have wisely have declined. It would hurt her to see how they ignore me during this process)
Anyway, she occupies a place of honor and respect in my heart the witnesses cannot touch. She visits us maybe three Saturdays a month and always comes to encourage and support. She always brings some food, sausage or cheese or cookies! Real old fashion mom! She expresses interest in spiritual things and discussions. Once we all watched a movie together about Jesus. She just wiped her eyes in appreciation. She says things like "Oh, what a lovey scripture! I like anything that is right from the Bible!" She also makes a point to remind us that she believes that all religions have some value as it is important and healthy for humans to feel gratitude to their creator.
A couple of times she has claimed to have read a Watchtower or Awake and said she approves of their Bible based nature. She agrees that Jesus was more likely the son of God, but not God himself. But she has said she has read also the writings of the Bahai Faith which accepts the core doctrines of all faiths.
Maybe what I am trying to say is this Riverwatcher, I have confidence in this woman's heart and immense sense of love for me and her son. If I had a child I would not hesitate for one minute to leave it in this womans care. I know she will do it no harm and will not fill its little heart with scary stories of the end of the world or that God is watching its every move and will destroy it for its sins. She is a saintly person, lover of animals, children and people.
That is the position you can have in your sons family as well. Earth Mother! Always loving. Always gentle!
Always supportive! You will be a source of refreshment to your son and daughter in law! A break from the conditional love they receive at the Kingdom Hall.
Think of it. Maybe the only reason they both can be witnesses is because they are receiving some unconditional love in their lives.......from you sweet mom!
Hang in there! Pray for your kids and grandchild and love love love them. Love never fails!