Seriously, they`re burning down our embassys now. (page 5)

Pleasuredome

come on guys, the world wouldnt be the same without them!

drew sagan

It's the signs of the times! Oh my gosh, I think meeting attendence just went up a quarter of a point!

kid-A

I remember the words of a middle east journalist commenting on western perceptions of the muslim world:

"The problem is not that all muslims are terrorists, its that almost all terrorists are muslims"

Sadly, this is the truth. Having said that, I know many liberal iranians and iraqis whom I consider friends, however, none of them are practicing muslims. One important distinction is in the early origins of islam versus christianity. Mohammed was essentially a warrior prophet, whose message was fundamentally based upon the principle of forced conversion of enemy tribes for the purpose of consolidating territorial power in the arabian peninsula. This was an insanely violent region around the time mohammed appeared.

While christianity no doubt had its bloody origins as well (post-Christ), its fundamental philosophy as originally taught by Christ is based upon the opposite of this principle, peace, charity, forgiveness and the avoidance of conflict (i.e. turning the other cheek etc). In that vein, christianity in its original form (before Paul began to put a more militant spin on it) was closer to buddhist philosophy.

Think

Calm down guys. No need to panic. There are authorities, that will take care of that. No need to start WW III.

Bee cool.

Relax.

Hellrider

Hellrider, what if you wake up one day and realise you live in a greedy society that only cares for itself, wasteful and polluting, dominated by money with a thirst for exhaustable resources, inextricable desire for sex, and free speech no matter who it hurts, and believes itself better than any other world view, .... are YOU prepared to "leave it" as you put it.

No, because there is no better alternative. There is the west (including some non-western countries, such as Japan), with it`s democracy and freedom of speech and religion, and then there`s the rest. I don`t like communism, so I won`t go live in China. I don`t like theocratic dictatorships, so the middle east is out of the question, as well as northern Africa. Then there`s south-America and eastern Europe, but there`s to much corruption and poverty there, so I think I`m gonna stay right were I am... And anyway, freedom is better than dictatorshit, it always has, always will, no matter what.

No, but seriously, you make a perfectly valid point, and in fact I agree with you, much more than you think! I am kind of "oldfashioned" you see, most of the time I get criticised for that, so now I`m happy to see that you`re also this way... I too dislike the greed, the thirst for money, resources, the sex, I can`t even put on the TV without having a tit shoved in my face. I hate the "reality"-shows, I dislike almost everything that`s on the TV, the only thing I like to watch is those crazy snakehandling australians on National Geographic and the Discovery channel, plus a couple of other shows, like South Park, the Simpsons and Prison Break. The rest, I dislike, especially MTV, I hate the "15-minutes of fame"-mentality I see everywhere. I dislike all these things, and to the best of my ability, I don`t participate in these things. I don`t have a car, our appartment is average in size, and I make sure to recycle. Yes, I do live in a greedy society, but that doesn`t mean that I like it. I have a very average income, no wealth here, no sir, and my student loan and house-loan is just killing me, plus we have a kid to provide for. So, even though I live in the kind of society you described, this doesn`t mean that I participate, at least not more than I have to. Now, I`m not trying to portray myself as "morally superior", or anything like that, what I am saying is that some things are wrong, and some are right, period. No matter what culture or religion you are raised in, are you in any way free of responsibility of your actions, and the way you behave. It is your duty to see the faults in your society, yes, we all have this duty. I see the hypocricy and the wrong things in our western societies, and I don` t have to participate in them. In the same way, I would like to see moslems not participating in what their religious leaders tell them to participate in, but I can`t see that. On the contrary, I see the whole goddamn west bank out protesting and throwing rocks at our embassys and burning our flags and threatening us with war. And I see moslems living in my own country, some of which are even born and raised here as 2nd generation immigrants, stand there and tell me that "this means war!". What the hell is that! But I think Spectrum makes a good point:

the west has democracy at home but exports war and crime to the countries it wishes to subjugate. How then is the west any better?

I can`t argue with that.

outoftheorg

Well I will be damned. Some of the world is finally waking up and have to acknowledge, that they are facing a religious war with the muslims.

A repeat of what has happened several times in the European past. But now it includes most of the world.

Welcome to reality.

Outoftheorg

FairMind

The Muslims are yet another example of the danger of religion

Not exactly! Jesus Christ said "Love Your Neighbor" the muslims say "Kill Your Neighbor. Islam is not just a religion it's a facist political movement that the world would be better off without (and maybe will be).

ballistic

I don't have all the answers Hellrider, but I plan to open my mind further. I work for one of the biggest American companies, right here in England, and I am leaving at the end of March. It's all set. I am planning to get on my motorbike and travel, Europe first, but I may go further, middle East, Africa, to see what life has to offer. Wish me luck.

Hellrider

Of course! Good luck, and take care.

Spectrum

Ballistic
Stay out of the middle east anything can happen. Brits aren't very popular there right now. I was thinking of going to Jordan to see the desert and Petra just about the time when the bombs went off. Up until then I really thought that Jordan was safe. Now I don't see any middle eastern country as safe. Cyprus is as east as I'll get in the middle east.

Seriously, they`re burning down our embassys now.

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