The "Sovereignty" Doctrine is Stupid

by metatron 28 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  metatron

  Perhaps some of you had to suffer thru the Society's latest special talk in which they rehashed the idea that our Evil world exists

  because Satan's challenges have to be answered.

  .... but no one ever reasons on what a truly dumb idea this is!

  The dumb part of it is the fact that Jehovah is said to sustain the universe, "making it rain upon the wicked and the righteous".

  There is simply no way that God could be challenged on a "moral" basis since there is no way to ever prove that God

  "cheated" or undermined the test by the use of his ominiscient ( and omnipotent) powers!

  Imagine Satan strutting into a casino ( rather like the heavenly Bellagio in Vegas, I think). He then announces that he can 'beat the house'!

  He is then systematically stripped of every dime he has by every possible distortion of chance, from marked cards he cannot detect

  to roulette wheels weighted invisibly. Individual atoms rebel against him as the liquid in his drink defies ordinary probability and rises

  upward. He not only loses, but cannot even prove or specify exactly how it happened. There is simply no way to contest God's "right

  to rule" except by completely and abjectly depending on God's sense of "fair play" - according to Satan's opinion - and with any

  contrary verification impossible.

  The "Challenge to Jehovah's Sovereignty" idea is just a silly product of looking at God as if he was a limited human and not

  an omnipotent Creator. It can't be taken seriously.

  metatron
• 

  Gopher

  our Evil world exists because Satan's challenges have to be answered.

  Does any religion other than the JW's teach this concept?

  So, hasn't enough time passed yet to prove "Satan" wrong? If the challenges have to be answered, what is God waiting for? Hasn't enough time passed? Hasn't enough trouble in this 'wicked system' happened to satisfy this God?

  The ones who really need to give an answer are religious leaders who teach that they, as God's sole representatives, must be served and obeyed while humanity is waiting on God to finally bring this supposed great change.
• 

  LDH

  No to burst the spiritual air in your tires, dude, but all of their doctrines are stupid.

  Agreed, though, as I posed it to another fundy on this forum last week who refused to answer (or more likely, couldn't)

  ......I'm going to agree for one second that this argument is correct. Let's say next week we're in the new system after Jehovah's sovriegnty has been proven. Of what teaching value is it? Can we talk about it? Can we tell "Jonas and Ezekiel" that the system went on for thousands more years after their death?

  How many generations does God need to see killed off to 'prove' he is sovreign?

  Lisa

  1 shoulda been enough, Class
• 

  DannyHaszard

  Yep,i had it drilled into me since i was a dub baby.We would as a family watch the old WB FBI show from the 1960's that ran on Sundays after Walt Disney.My elder dad would make the final epilogue shootout a Biblical object lesson on Satan's belligerent opposition to Jehovah's sovereignty. If i miss-behaved at playtime it was an affront to Jehovah's sovereignty BTW Jehovah is not God's name.
• 

  metatron

  Yup, but each doctrine is stupid in it's own way..........!

  metatron
• 

  Tea4Two

  I would like to have an answer to that question......Are we pawns in a game between God and Satan.....It doesn't justifi the hundreds of years of suffering by humans in this water torture type nonsense.
• 

  EAGLE-1

  I am not playing
• 

  r51785

  Only JW's teach this doctrine. The idea that there is a universal court case in which Satan is the plaintiff and Jehovah is the defendant and we are "Jehovah's witnesses" is an idea that sprung from the fertile imagination of the attorney who invented this silly irrelevant little sect.
• 

  greendawn

  I agree that God's integrity could not be called in question and that idea is a stupid invention of the morbid JW mind, at the end of the day satan and his angels were created by God out of nothing and if they weren't happy with their lives they could go back where they came from.
  
  The issue never was one of proving God's soundness as a ruler because his rule is obviously just.
• 

  sinis

  I thought about this very thing as I walked across the parking lot from school this morning. I looked at a few animals scavaging for found by one of the bins and another one running pretty fast across the hot parking lot, and thought to myself that I am basically no different than these simple animals. Although I am seeking a higher education, really what does it give me. I still will have to work in this life, my body will start to fall apart, and I might have 60 or so years, from now, before I kick the bucket. Then what?!?!? Then I thought back about the Uni.Sov. issue and thought to myself how stupid is that? If god was all powerfull why would he allow a lessor "god" even challenge him? He would know what the outcome was. It would be like me telling a small child not to touch the stove while it is on or they will get burned. I have more knowledge than they, and I know what the outcome will be. So if they defy me I have every right to punish them. It would be cruel for me to allow them to touch it only to get burned and then tell them "I told you so".

  I know you should make life as enjoyable as possible, and humans tend to look at the short term. In the long term what REALLY bothers me is that after my life is used up thats it, wow, BFD. Then what you go to heaven? If thats the case wouldn't it be PERFECTLY clear that that is the case, and just maybe a dead loved one WOULD tell you of the benefits of living a good life? I think the harsh reality, though I would really like to believe in a higher creature, is that once you die you are fodder...