The Bribe of Heaven and The Threat of Hell. (page 2)

gumby

OFG....I just KNEW you've been smokin that phallic colas on the top of your garden....I KNEW it!

k.....back to topic

Gumby

bem

Quote from Blueblades

I do not fear that I will go to hell because of this, nor do I think that I will go to heaven if I change my mind. Whatever awaits me after death will come no matter what I believe.

Before my jw years, (I was brought in through the preaching work) I was somewhere between being a baptist when I was with my mom and church of christ when with my grandparents, raised in mormon country with catholics and jws for friends, so I have been exposed to a lot of beliefs.I was real angry about there being no perfectly new sytem to look forward to at first but now. I am thinking we probably do not know all there is to know from the bible's we have today, we don't even know how complete the works we have now are, If heaven or hell exists no one can prove it to me from this point in life/time so as the quote says. No matter what I believe or the religious persons believe. it still don't mean jack crap till we die and find out or never know what happens.

* just a note, the main idea I am no longer confused I just refuse to let fear guide my life.

Deputy Dog

gumby You never answered my first question.

If not for the bible, why would you believe in heaven or hell?

Have you ever done a critical examination of the bible?

That would probably depend on what you mean by "a critical examination"

My guess is.....you have not.

Is your "guess" based on the fact that we don't agree about the bible? As for thinking outside of the box, I can think through either presupposition. D Dog

greendawn

For me it was the search to understand the need of man for spiritual meaning and spiritual life and culture without which we would still be living in the caves.

Also the world around us indicates strongly an intelligently directed activity by someone who knew what he was doing.

The Bible answers well to these needs.

LittleToe

What has Heaven or Hell got to do with anything?

For those who claim to love Christ they are merely side-issues in their philosophy of an afterlife.

As I once said to my [ex]wife; "I'd rather be in Hell with Christ, than in Heaven without him". It's about a relationship, not a destination.

Blueblades

Little toe, with all do respect to you, as I have not posted any responses to your many posts's. Knowing that you have an experience that you have not spoken about on this forum. IT is not about Jesus, it is about whether or not we believe that what is writen in the Bible is the truth about God in the teachings of heaven or hell. I know that you would never put anyone you love or fathered into an eternal hell. Tell me I am wrong about this.

Blueblades

freedomlover

I have reached the same conclusions BB.

LT's *experience* is something I am envious of some days. What sort of experience can give you such reverance for Christianity? Most times when I contemplate these things, I wish for an *experience* - seems like it may make my path a little less complicated. probably not though. just a case of "the grass is always greener."

I love the idea, the aura, that the idea of xianty deals with. the ideals, the thougths, - beautiful. poetry in motion. however, I am not a "Christian" or any other label for that matter.

lowden

Hello Blueblades

IMO, if god suddenly took away the 'carrot' of heaven and said, 'I'm not doing this anymore i've changed my mind, it's just me, jesus and a few angels now...that's it! You're all gonna just die when you die and that's it'!!

Well i don't think anyone, (or very few) would serve god then! I really do believe that people that say otherwise are in denial. Heaven is just a big fat carrot. People become JWs for one thing and one thing only and that's the PARADISE, it's the point of sale and the gratification of ones own selfish ideal. Hell is 'the BIG STICK' that religious leaders hit us with.

Peace

Lowden

gumby

gumby You never answered my first question.
If not for the bible, why would you believe in heaven or hell?

DD.....are you implying that the subject of Heaven and Hell only comes from the Bible? Heaven and Hell were believed in before the Bible. All cultures have their ideas of bliss and damnation and the Bible is just another one of those. As for your looking into the sceptical examination of the bible....I think you know what I meant. Read some non-christian authored books about the bible, and maybe you'll understand where many such as myself are coming from as to whether it should be labeled as "Gods Word" to mankind. Gumby

LittleToe

BB:
On the contrary, it's entirely about relationship, if you interpret Heaven and Hell the way that I do.

Are they "places" or "states in relation to God"? I choose the latter, in my belief framework. That being the case, the destination doesn't become the choice so much as availing oneself of a relationship (be that with a Pauline-style "experience" or not).

Lowden:As for service - I've never really seen it that way, either. When I enjoy a relationship with someone it's hardly about bowing and scraping, but rather enjoying their company, which is "Heaven". If there comes a day when that's extinguished, then that becomes "Hell". As above, so below...

Gumby:Good call. The concepts, with variation, are found in many cultures and certainly predate Christianity by a loooong way.

The Bribe of Heaven and The Threat of Hell.

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