Who's to say Jesus has "approved" the FDS and "appointed them..."

by Theocrat 28 Replies latest jw friends

  • ozziepost
    ozziepost
    It seems JW's just assume that Jesus did inspect them and did appoint them over his belongings.

    Very true and it's a point that we probably should hit the WTS with more often.

    From what I recall when a dub, it was indeed an assumption - they said it, they claimed it, so, well, it must be true, and hey! it was too hard to investigate and I didn't have time. Isn't that true of most dubs with that teaching?

    The thing is that I could see inconsistencies in the teachings over the 1914-18 period and for too long I overlooked them thinking that Jehovah will make it clear in His own time.

    How foolish!

  • BlackSwan of Memphis
    BlackSwan of Memphis
    Whose to say? Me. I say that the governing body is the elders of the congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses. The term "Faithful and discreet slave" has been bandied about so much by the right and the left that it has become a cliche. It does not matter. The governing body is the overseers of the worldwide congregation and its support staff. They do not need to be appointed by Jesus for people to be obedient to them because Heb 13:7,17 says to do so because they are the ones taking the lead among us.

    Ooooooooookay Grissom.... Who voted 'em in? Where did they get the authority to take the lead? By their fruits ye shall know em. Their fruits says that they are liars.
    Their fruits says that they harbour criminals. (don't even get me started on that so just SHhhh) Their fruits says that they are hypocrites. Their fruits says that they twisted the words of the Bible to their own means. Basically they have some seriously rotten fruit that they are feeding to their members. If I have to choose who would lead me to God, it is not going to be them. On the other hand, why on earth would you ever think that these fallible men are capable of leading you to God? What do they have that you can't get from God himself? From Jesus himself? Why are you buying from the Watchtower what you can get free from God? whatever BSoM

  • Free
    Free
    LIKE FALSE PROPHCIES ARE A SMALL MATTER ? YEAH YOU JISSOM
  • Free
    Free

    How about the other 8,000 people of that slave class , why don't the dudes in Brooklyn ask their opinions ?

  • Theocrat
    Theocrat

    I don't quite understand Grissom's line of thinking on this, but let me clarify the issue I'm brining up:

    1914 is explained to death...prophecy from Daniel, "appointed times of the nations", 2520 years counted from 607 and so forth. They haven't fallen short in giving us "evidence" as to 1914.

    But with the matter of the scriptural FDS, it's being inspected, approved, and appointed by Jesus, THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO "EVIDENCE" GIVEN! They just say that it happened. Wait, says who? I could go to my co-workers and say, "Hey just so you know, the boss said I'm in charge now and that you'll have to do what I say and anybody that tries to go to him instead of me will get fired." But that wouldn't be an actually appointment, it would be usurping.

    In a religion where so-called "evidence" stacks on top of more "evidence", why is there just an assumption that the governing body in Brooklyn was approved by Jesus? Now I'm not saying that they are probably the "evil slave" because the one characteristic that Jesus provides for us at Matthew 24 is that the evil slave would claim that Jehovah's day would be "delaying".

  • bebu
    bebu

    May I add one more question into this? Back up one more step...

    Where in the world does it say that Jesus was supposed to come and inspect the churches to begin with?? Or pick one out as his approved?? Where did this assumption come from??

    Is there some Biblical passage they are using to say this would happen? If so, which one(s)??

    bebu

  • greendawn
    greendawn

    It's easy to make a claim but one has to beware of such claims that can't be proven, the JWs claim that a number of things happened in the invisible realm and they are the only ones that somehow know they happened, but how do we know they are not lying or imagining things?

    It could well be a wild grandiose claim that is calculated to give them importance that will entice people into accepting them as their leaders. They will then climb on their backs like any daughter of Babylon and control and direct them according to their interests.

    Given their bad fruitage one wonders how would Christ choose them over so many others who are just like them.

  • bebu
    bebu

    Well, actually that was 5 more questions. (Aside from the question asking if I could ask a question...)

    bebu

  • TD
    TD


    Grissom wanted to know what the problem is. There are actually multiple problems with the JW view:

    First: How can you be appointed by Christ over all his belongings and not even know it?

    Jesus ostensibly returns in 1914, conducts his inspection and subsequently appoints the faithful Bible Students over all his belongings. --Only they don't know it because they don't know the Faithful and Wise Steward is a "class" of faithful Christians. They think the Faithful and Wise Steward was a single individual --Charles Taze Russell.

    Fast forward 10 years and they still don't know of their appointment, because they still think the individual was Russell. It was not until 1928 that they decided that the Faithful and Wise Steward was composed of individual Christians.

    Second: Under what circumstances is it permissible for a slave of Christ to declare himself faithful?

    Since Jesus did not make this alleged appointment in any tangible fashion, (As evidenced by the 10 year lacunae) then the status of Faithful and Discreet is entirely self-proclaimed. In other words, Jesus did not declare the slave righteous, the slave has declared himself righteous. Doesn't the judging of Christians as faithful or not more properly fall under Jesus' perview?

    Ignoring this problem creates a ludicrous circularity in Witness reasoning because the claim becomes in effect, the authority to make the claim in a snake swallowing his own tail sort of fashion.

    IOW JW's know that their Governing Body compose the mouthpiece of the Slave because that selfsame group has told them so. Conversely, JW's know that they can trust what their Governing Body says because they compose the mouthpiece of the Slave.

    Third: Jesus never actually said what the outcome of the slave would be. The slave could either be rewarded or punished based upon what he was found doing at Christ's return. This makes the story a parable, not a prophecy The Witnesses treat it as the latter because they assume the favorable outcome. However Jesus actually said no such thing.

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