thanks frankie and FMZ for your remarks to my post..just wanted you to know that I read them :)
hugs
essie
(who hopes to hell if reincarnation is real that she learns the damned lesson SOON already before she moves on again!)
Children who claim to remember past life
by frankiespeakin 86 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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frankiespeakin
Ab,
Frankie,I think we can agree that no-one's proved this, but there is interesting anecdotal evidence. Like there was with acupuncture - but then that got proved to any reasonable level of scientific satisfaction. It took thousands of years, but then it's not something that has always or universally been practised. Homoeopathic medicine is still to satisfy a reasonable level of proof, but all the signs are it will.
Sorry I didn't get back to you right away, don't have as much time as I used to these days,(new girlfriend).
Yes I think we can agree, about the evidence, I don't consider it absolute, but substantial. That is, if one gives it some carefull consideration. The books i choose to read on the subject are basically by Phds who put thier academic reputation on the line, and are for the most part college professors. As far as what can be considered enough evidence, that depends on the person and the degree and to what degree they are a materialist.
Whether this thing you're discussing will follow acupuncture in to provability remains to be seen but there's at least one major logical problem - it's unlikely this is a new thing (if it is real). Why then hasn't it been satisfactorily documented on numerous occasions. It's also unlikely to be a geographically limited phenomenon. And pretty unlikely to be a cultural or religiously unique thing (if it is real) - unless there are many god and each set of believers have a different afterlife (or as Pratchett amusingly speculates, people get the afterlife they expect). If it is real, it's rather unlikely to STILL defy a reasonable standard of proof as it is probably been happening a VERY long time (if not as long as since humans were humans) wherever humans were in all cultures no matter what they believed.
Your right it isn't a new thing, the ideas of rebirths have been around for thousands of years. Eastern religions, the Egyptian and Tibetian books of the dead, have been around along time, even the bible and many of the unendorsed(by early church fathers) ancient christian books speak of it. Large segments of the worlds population believe in reincarnation. In ancient times I don't think they required copious amont of emperical evidence. I think the evidence that is most authentic is what you experience, the eastern religions with their meditative practices give one much esoteric evidence, and no doubt that's one of the reasons, the mystical type of religious cult taught it. As Ken Wilber writes, the sceptics should practice some of these techniques to see for themselves instead of dismissing everthing "out of hand".
It's like mind powers; unless they are an emergent characteristic not universally expressed in the population that hasn't had sufficient time to spread through the population or is not a trait that increases fitness (as measured by numbers of descendent's), mind powers have been around long enough all over the place to make lack of proof suspicious.
I think quantum physics, and some of the evidence supporting(faster than the speed of light communications between subatomic particles) is leading many to understand the the universe is nonlocal. Actually space and time are all illusions of the observer, if the universe is nonlocal. It is surprising to me how many physicist turn to these are interested in these esoteric ideas.
I have to admit I would LOVE mind powers to be true, as I would love reincarnation to be true. My fiancé has clear recollections of having met me in a previous life. I have a memory of a few seconds that seems to be real (not a dream memory, too many details) but would have been impossible for me to experience as it would have been hundreds of years ago. I can 'heal' my fiancé by 'laying on hands' on small injuries or hurts, at least to the extent of reducing or preventing swelling and reducing the level of pain experienced. I've done it to another person once - but I was doing it to see if I could make her feel better not because I think I have special power. Although that would be cool.
This experience you mention about you and your gf, seems common, researchers say that thier are couples that have many past lives where they were lovers and that sometimes they switch genders. Nice hearing from you.
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frankiespeakin
Bttt
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Pistoff
I haven't read all the posts, so maybe this was covered.
There is a decent book on this called "Old Souls"; the book does not make claims but does document the very extensive number of such cases in the Middle East.
I am interested in the stories; don't know what to make of them.
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Robdar
Let's run with Frankies premise from another thread: All is illusion. Wouldn't that would mean that Reincarnation is an illusion? Wouldn't it meant that there is no death, only illusion? Since all is an illusion, how can there be reincarnation when we don't really die? Eh, Frankie?
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frankiespeakin
Rob,
Everything is an illusion, some call the universe a hologram with everything coming out of the emptiness. Some say there is some sorta time feed back information loop that make the present seem in motion and the passage of what appears to be time.
And so all past lives are an illusion because they are past and not present, the present is a sumation of the past. The future is an illusion too something that is not with us and only imagined even if done so very accurately.
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Robdar
Ah yes, the holographic universe theory. Have you read any of the "Hands of Light" books by Barbara Ann Brennan? Interesting reading.