Children who claim to remember past life

by frankiespeakin 86 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  Robdar

  MKR:

  This is idiotic it's like arguing with a scientologist... Or maybe a Jehovah's witless

  FMZ:

  MKR, by virtue of the apostate amendment to Godwin's Law... you lose. From the Godwin's Law FAQ.. (replace Nazis with JWs):

  Regardless of Godwin's Law, MKR has a point. The author of this thread is arguing like a JW by ignoring opposing opinions, all the while stating his belief as fact. In order to avoid dissenting opinion, he has started a second thread and is now threatening to start a third. He is dancing around the issues--just like a JW.
• 

  frankiespeakin

  Rob,

  No it is not taken from the TBD as far as I know but many psychiatrist Timothy Leary, Ralph Metzinger,S. Grof, and many more find the TBD very interesting and full of insights.

  click on links:

  http://www.lycaeum.org/books/books/psychedelic_experience/tibetan.html

  http://www.hofmann.org/papers/HallucinogenicDPPS.html

  Timothy Leary, stimulated by his association with Aldous Huxley, Huston Smith and Alan Watts, devoted considerable time and energy to exploring and describing the spiritual and religious dimensions of psychedelic experience. This work resulted in adaptations of the Tibetan Buddhist Bardo Thödol (Leafy, Metzner & Albert 1964) and the Chinese Taoist Tao Te Ching (Leafy 1997) as guidebooks for psychedelic experience. Based on his initiating experience with Mexican magic mushrooms, it would also be true to say that Leary was the first person to recognize and articulate that the fundamental mystical vision that emerges in these states is an evolutionary remembering--an experience of reconnecting with our biological and cosmological evolution. In other words, he realized the experience went beyond the personal and cultural developmental issues that usually concern psychologists, and that the language of mystics and shamans in our time was basically going to be the scientific language of evolution.
• 

  mkr32208

  now threatening to start a third

  too late...

  I'm not a moderator (hmmm wonder why) so I can't lock the spam threads like they deserve so I'll just be so nasty in them that people don't post or get into a flame war with me (which is fun) and take his threads off topic or get so nasty that they get locked! Fine with me either way but I HATE spammers!

  (and idiots too!)
• 

  FMZ

  Robdar, I agree, the extra threads were unnecessary, but the thread has now degraded into nothing but mudslinging by those that disagree with Frankie. This is no longer a productive discussion.

  Now I remember why discussion boards can be so infuriating. I have absolutely no problem with people disagreeing with me, but when they decide to call me crazy and "absurd" for my beliefs, rather than having a civil discussion about the topic at hand is when I step back. I feel no need to prove anything to anyone, and thus I am not vested at all in continuing this discussion.

  FMZ
• 

  Narkissos

  I mean it in the sense that it is commonly used. Reincarnation of the personality, what ever form or state that is. What exactly is reincarnated can only be explained in metaphysical terms whose meaning is vague in that we still don't know what we are. I beleive we are much more than we appear to be, just as quantum physic is revealing.

  If individual "personality" is an accidental and temporary shape resulting of the combination of many factors -- genetics, language, culture, education, etc. -- what is the point of having it identically reproduced somewhere down the course of events which is supposed to result from the ongoing action of the same factors?

  Iow, doesn't reincarnation imply that an individual "personality" is something else than the combination of those factors?

  The only "research" I can figure about reincarnation belongs to the history of ideas and beliefs. I have a hard time understanding how it can be put on the same plane as genetics, neurology, psychology, linguistics, sociology etc. without frontally clashing with them.
• 

  Robdar

  it would also be true to say that Leary was the first person to recognize and articulate that the fundamental mystical vision that emerges in these states is an evolutionary remembering--an experience of reconnecting with our biological and cosmological evolution. In other words, he realized the experience went beyond the personal and cultural developmental issues that usually concern psychologists, and that the language of mystics and shamans in our time was basically going to be the scientific language of evolution.

  Dude, with all due respect, Timothy Leary was f**ked up on drugs. He tripped enough times to be considered legally insane and I wouldn't quote him as a legit source.

  Granted, I believe psychodelics psychedelics can be used to tap into the collective consciousness that Jung was fond of talking about. But head trips do not constitute universal truths.
• 

  Robdar

  Now I remember why discussion boards can be so infuriating. I have absolutely no problem with people disagreeing with me, but when they decide to call me crazy and "absurd" for my beliefs, rather than having a civil discussion about the topic at hand is when I step back. I feel no need to prove anything to anyone, and thus I am not vested at all in continuing this discussion.

  Point well made and taken.
• 

  frankiespeakin

  Nark,

  If individual "personality" is an accidental and ;temporary shape resulting of the combination of many factors -- genetics, language, culture, education, etc. -- what is the point of having it identically reproduced somewhere down the course of events which is supposed to result from the ongoing action of the same factors?

  From what I understand about reincarnation. the reproduction is not identical. The thoughts and experiences that make up former lives is what is carried over to the next life for further work. I think it is very ecconomical that all those experiences are not lost but retained, and a person isn't always starting from scratch.

  Iow, doesn't reincarnation imply that an individual "personality" ;is something else than the combination of those factors?

  I think so.

  The only "research" I can figure about reincarnation belongs to the history of ideas and beliefs. I have a hard time understanding how it can be put on the same plane as ;genetics, neurology, psychology, linguistics, sociology etc. ;without frontally clashing with them.

  Psychologist are very interested in it because some of our mental problems can be helped by regressing back to some of our former lives and just reliving them. Many cases of healing psychosomatic desease have occured.
• 

  frankiespeakin

  Nark,

  Carl jung who also took reincarnation seriously. He was raised with experiences in the paranormal. He saw the mythology of our ansesters as telling us about the deeper inner working of the psychi. Anyway C Jung looked to the eastern mystics for insights into the mind. He was also able to get in touch with certain spirit guides which gave him many insights and earned him the respect of many of those in his profession.
• 

  Narkissos

  Frankie,

  One thing is to draw insight and inspiration from traditional religious material, as I think Jung did (mostly).

  A completely different thing is to take it at face value and try to prove that its underlying beliefs and worldviews were literally right.

  That's about the difference between a philosopher's and an apologist's approach to the Bible.

  To each his own...