Prayer?

by Satanus 13 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Satanus
    Satanus

    Some quotes from a little article that put into words thoughts that i have had at times:

    People prefer deification as it gives consolation and confirmation. It is an escape and not liberation. One who comprehends it as a short cut never reaches the destination.

    Prayer belongs to the mass and meditation to the individual. Only the individual is indivisible. Meditation is the last leap to reach the celestial. It is prayer without praying.

    Prayer denotes duality and meditation means merger, coalescence, dissolving and disappearing.

    God is more of a feeling and less of a concept.

    God is our attempt to give finite configuration to the infinite formlessness. It is an exercise to limit the limitless and an endeavour to explain the abstract.

    A man of meditation sees his own reflection on everything around him. He never plagiarises the pleas of others to trace the tracts of the providence.

    God is nameless, formless and even Godless.

    http://www.hinduonnet.com/thehindu/mp/2005/09/03/stories/2005090300750400.htm

    Add pro or con comments as you wish.

    S

  • purplesofa
    purplesofa
    God is nameless, formless and even Godless.

    This makes sense.......using the name Jehovah is identifable to the holy bible. He once seemed BIG but now seems very small.

    Prayer belongs to the mass and meditation to the individual. Only the individual is indivisible.

    Prayer rooted on trust and grafted on bliss is a love affair. Everything in existence is admired as an act of almighty. God is more of a feeling and less of a concept. Genuine prayers are meant not to avoid sufferings but to consolidate our strength to withstand the torrent of torment

    .

    Reminds me of the thread of the girl that thought Jehovah protected her purse.

    purps

  • Twitch
    Twitch
    People prefer deification as it gives consolation and confirmation.

    Yea, it's pretty cold out there and there are wolves.

    Prayer belongs to the mass and meditation to the individual.

    You mean ponder my own existence and that of which I'm a part of?

    Prayer denotes duality and meditation means merger, coalescence, dissolving and disappearing.

    The whole father/son thing was comforting and was something solid I could identify with too.

    God is more of a feeling and less of a concept.

    Somebody said God is Love, which I think is true.

    God is our attempt to give finite configuration to the infinite formlessness.

    Could a fly connect to the internet? ;-)

    A man of meditation sees his own reflection on everything around him.

    Are we not all the same and on this boat together?

    God is nameless, formless and even Godless.

    The further you look, the further things are,....

    Thanks for the thoughts

  • serendipity
    serendipity

    Hi S,

    God is our attempt to give finite configuration to the infinite formlessness. It is an exercise to limit the limitless and an endeavour to explain the abstract.

    I agree with this. Humans speak in terms they know, so they anthropomorphize God. Thanks to technology, our knowledge and realm of experience is greater than humans even a century ago. I wonder how this changes the attempts to define God.

    Belief in a God that cares about humans and the promise of an afterlife gives more significance and meaning to human life.

    But you were asking about prayer....

  • Narkissos
    Narkissos
    Prayer belongs to the mass and meditation to the individual.

    Not necessarily imo. Whenever you pray, do not be like the hypocrites; for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, so that they may be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward. But whenever you pray, go into your room and shut the door and pray to your Father who is in secret.

    Only the individual is indivisible.

    Is s/he? I'd rather consider the individual as an infinitely divisible compound.

    Prayer denotes duality and meditation means merger, coalescence, dissolving and disappearing.

    Maybe. One might also regard prayer as a gateway to meditation. Starting with two, ending with one -- or zero?

    God is more of a feeling and less of a concept.

    God is our attempt to give finite configuration to the infinite formlessness. It is an exercise to limit the limitless and an endeavour to explain the abstract.

    Am I wrong or do this two assertions imply two different definitions of "God"?

    A man of meditation sees his own reflection on everything around him.

    Then he is utterly alone, isn't he? Edmond Jabès once defined mysticism as theophagy ("eating God"); by this definition it even boils down to heterophagy ("eating the other").

    God is nameless, formless and even Godless.
    Who?
  • BrendaCloutier
    BrendaCloutier

    Wow.

    Satanus, that makes amazing sense. Thank you!

  • Arthur
    Arthur

    I have always had so much trouble with the Hebrew Old Testament god. This was a god of human falibilites, weaknesses, and an insecure alter-ego. I got so sick and tired of God being presented to us as this cosmic bearded old man who rides around on a chariot, and gets his panties in a wad every time someone celebrates Thanksgiving or gives a birthday card.

    When I think about the intellect required to design DNA, the manifestion of this through the evolutionary process, and the power required to create billions upon billions of suns, I just cannot accept the Judeo-Christian god who has all sorts of anthropomorphic human limitations and weaknesses.

    It is obvious that infinite power and intelligence is beyond gender, beyond human form, and beyond weak human emotions. Why does such power and intelligence need a big publishing corporation, and a totalitarian religious power structure to keep all of his servants in lock-step conformity. Why does this power and intelligence need to use mind control, and foster guilt and fear through piles of books and magazines?

    Such a god is not omnipotent. This sort of god is limited; and for lack of better terms: impotent. The JW god has more in common with Charlton Heston than it does the infinite power and intelligence.

  • TopHat
    TopHat

    Prayer is a wonderful thing.....Just look what it does for JW's....just 266 more Insurance checks to go and their prayers will be answered.

    Jehovah’s Witnesses recently established a formal system that uses small Bible study groups as key links in a chain of contacts. On Sept. 11, 2001, said Charles Wolfersberger, a spokesman who lives in Seminole, “We couldn’t contact everybody.’’ This new, formal system will help Jehovah’s Witnesses keep in touch before and after an emergency, he said. “We want to know where they are. We want to help. We want not only a local number, but a phone number out of state,’’ he said.

    The religious group also prepares for disasters by training followers in the building trades, so they can help repair or reconstruct homes of fellow believers and those outside their religious community as well. Their Regional Building Committees, which build the group’s centers of worship, or Kingdom Halls, are mobilized for disasters. Volunteers repaired more than 5,000 homes damaged during last year’s hurricane season, Wolfersberger said. The last 266, in New Orleans, were only approved for repair by city officials on July 1, but work is expected to be complete in a few weeks, he said

  • Satanus
    Satanus

    Some of the questions and comments like:

    But you were asking about prayer....

    Prayer denotes duality and meditation means merger, coalescence, dissolving and disappearing.

    Maybe. One ;might also regard prayer as ;a gateway to meditation. Starting with two, ending with one -- or zero?

    God is more of a feeling and less of a concept.

    God is our attempt to give finite configuration to the infinite formlessness. It is an exercise to limit the limitless and an endeavour to explain the abstract.

    Am I wrong or do this two assertions imply two different definitions of "God"?

    are answered in the article. Therefore, i am quoting the full piece.

    ---------

    Our prayers are both conditional and conditioned. The viscosity of fear and gravity of grief determine the density of prayer. Prayer is popular, as it is easy to preach and practice. We are comfortable with rituals because others can perform them on our behalf. Affluence is the affordability to maximise sloth.

    People prefer deification as it gives consolation and confirmation. It is an escape and not liberation. One who comprehends it as a short cut never reaches the destination. Assumption of suffering as a form of prayer presupposes God as a sadist.

    Prayer belongs to the mass and meditation to the individual. Only the individual is indivisible. Meditation is the last leap to reach the celestial. It is prayer without praying. J. Krishnamurti calls it, `silencing the mind'. Words and sounds dominate prayer and in meditation, the medium is serenity.

    The purpose of the former is purgation and the latter prophylactic. Prayer denotes duality and meditation means merger, coalescence, dissolving and disappearing.

    Prayer has profiles. A few sing hymns for selfish ends; a few kneel for the benevolence of others; a few prostrate for avenging their archrivals and only a handful fawn for global peace and cosmic tranquility. Some pray, as they do not know what to do. Our supplications are effective when they are espoused for the cause of others.

    Rooted on trust

    Prayer rooted on trust and grafted on bliss is a love affair. Everything in existence is admired as an act of almighty. God is more of a feeling and less of a concept. Genuine prayers are meant not to avoid sufferings but to consolidate our strength to withstand the torrent of torment.

    We pray in distress and not in joy. Our miseries are imputed to evil interventions and victories are viewed as fruits of indomitable efforts.

    Prayer could be transformed into pursuit of a higher plane of awareness by refining the mind. When our communion becomes gratitude expressed through gestures, we are showered with blessings.

    Vote of thanks is not the penultimate agenda in life; the programme often comes to a grinding halt. One who asks alms at the corridor and the other who pleads for boons at the sanctum sanctorum are both mendicants seeking from different sources. From begging and bargaining and from beseeching and petitioning, it can be elevated to a stance of ecstasy.

    Singing with celebration and dancing with delight for no reason and with no expectation takes invocation proximate to meditation. When prayer disappears and praying vanishes, something beautiful burgeons. Then one glows like camphor and floats like incense.

    The art of bringing the quality of prayer into all actions happens on its own without any enervating effort.

    Deliver through deeds

    Respecting the responsibility and discharging it with diligence are worship delivered through deeds. Counting the beads for countless times is of no use, if we miss the manifestation of the maker in all the innocent incarnations.

    God is our attempt to give finite configuration to the infinite formlessness. It is an exercise to limit the limitless and an endeavour to explain the abstract. We worship both the dead and the God. We place them on par.

    It is said that dogs could visualise their God only in the form of a dog, may be with an additional appendage or a straight tail. The devotees debate to decide the power of the deities. The dispute is more about the structure of buildings and not about the nature of supernatural.

    Bharathi proclaims, "There is more spirituality outside our temples." By writing the name of God, we feel like scribbling our own name and derive ego satisfaction. God has no name. Attributing a gender would also give a form. God is nameless, formless and even Godless.

    All our communal riots erupt when sounds of prayers of different denominations clash and when their timings overlap.

    Spirituality is a personal issue and not a public policy. Compassion is prayer lived and devotion demonstrated. The whole world can meditate at the same moment without any single whimper.

    A man of meditation sees his own reflection on everything around him. He never plagiarises the pleas of others to trace the tracts of the providence.

    R. Buckminster Fuller said, "God is not a noun but a verb." When God becomes a verb, we will have no quarrels over feature or stature.

    V. IRAI ANBU

    -------

    S

  • TopHat
    TopHat

    So to sum it all up, what is V. IRAI ANBU trying to tell himself. ......Prayer is useless??

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