by IronClaw 10 Replies latest jw friends
Does anybody know of scriptures that talk about speaking in tongues in the "Last Days"? I thought I read somewhere about it but can't seem to find it. For example: Did speaking in tongues stop with the death of the Apostles as per the WTBTS ? or is this still to be around up to Armageddon? Any info on this topic would be much appreciated.
Thanks, The Claw.
I know the bible says "DO NOT FORBID THE SPEAKING IN TONGUES" So I leave that in HIS hands I dont like hearing it. but I once heard of a story where Bill Cetner who used to write for Questions From Readers in the Watchtower. ...Had left the WT & was now speaking at a Church revealing the lies of the cult.
A Hungarian woman who was a doubting JW went to listen to him at the advice of a neighbour. ( THE CHURCH DID NOT KNOW SHE WAS GOING IT WAS A LAST MINIT INVITE)Someone got up & said in HUNGARIAN!!!!!! "to listen to this man he was a messenger from God." Then another got up at another part of the church & repeated it in English ...So I know that was one experience I believe. She came free after long talks with Bill
Have you read "SIGN OF THE LAST DAYS???? BY CARL OLAF JONSSON an ex JW ???? You might enjoy
Hi Claw,
I remember this one:
I Cor. 13:8 Love never fails. But where there are prophesying, they will be done away with; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will be done away with.......10 but when that which is complete arrives, that which is partial will be done away with.
I think the tongues, are speaking in different languages as to be able to spread the good news. Not the incoerrant stuff. And I'm thinking, (that which is complete) would be Jesus on his second coming.. What do you think.? What else could it be? hmm ...the tongues definately end..right?
Acts 2 expressly connects "speaking in tongues" or glossolalia (actually quite an idealistic version of it, since the real glossolalia attested in 1 Corinthians wasn't understandable without a charismatic "interpretation") with the "last days" (v. 17).
The only terminus ad quem indicated in 1 Corinthians 13, as StarMoore pointed out, is "when the complete comes" -- "then we will see face to face. Now I know only in part; then I will know fully, even as I have been fully known" (v. 12). In Pauline theology this points to the unique horizon of Christian hope, aka the parousia, which is the end of the "last days".
I give a talk on this week after next. I found this information helpful.
http://www.bible.org/page.asp?page_id=393
Justitia
I think you're thinking of the scripture in Joel:
(Joel 2:28-29) 28 "And after that it must occur that I shall pour out my spirit on every sort of flesh, and YOUR sons and YOUR daughters will certainly prophesy. As for YOUR old men, dreams they will dream. As for YOUR young men, visions they will see. 29 And even on the menservants and on the maidservants in those days I shall pour out my spirit.
It doesn't specifically mention speaking in tongues, but there are religious groups today who include the speaking in tongues as part of the "sign" of the Last Days or something like that....
So far, I've never heard of a translator admitting they have understood a tongue speaker. They babble nothing as it's all an emotional experience.
Joel 2:28-29) 28 "And after that it must occur that I shall pour out my spirit on every sort of flesh, and YOUR sons and YOUR daughters will certainly prophesy. As for YOUR old men, dreams they will dream. As for YOUR young men , visions they will see. 29 And even on the menservants and on the maidservants in those days I shall pour out my spirit.
I'd like to see any pastors response.... dub elders included, if a young man or a woman had a vision or a dream. They'd be labeled a looneybird in no time.
Gumby
In the link JustitiaThemis provided, I especially noticed the following
(6) It is a mistake for a woman to speak in tongues. “Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak . . .” (14:34). The prohibition here has a direct relation to the problem with which the Apostle is dealing, namely, speaking in tongues. Earlier in the same Epistle he told the women how to dress when they prayed or prophesied in the church (11 :3-10), therefore he would not forbid them here in Chapter 14 that privilege which is countenanced in Chapter 11. The setting of I Corinthians 14:34 has reference primarily to women speaking in tongues. It is clear and unmistakable that speaking in tongues was a gift limited to men and is never to be exercised by women. Now he is not saying that women may not teach or testify or pray, but that they may not speak in tongues. Elsewhere Paul writes, “But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence” (I Timothy 2: 12). The point of this passage is that a woman’s ministry must not usurp authority over the man. She may teach women or children, but not men.If this admonition were heeded today much of the present tongues movement would be eliminated. Women are the worst offenders in the modern confusion of tongues. The word “speak” in 14:34 is the same word used in verse 28, therefore it cannot mean mere “chatter” that would disturb a service in the church. The purpose of this entire section on speaking in tongues is to curb the wrong use of the gift. Verses 27-33 give instruction for men in the matter of speaking in tongues. “If any man speak in an unknown tongue . . .” (14:27); verses 34-36 are directed to “women” exercising the gift of tongues. And if any women wanted to take issue with Paul, he would ask them one question, “Which book in all the inspired Scriptures was written as the result of the Holy Spirit revealing the woman?” (Verse 36). It is a mistake for a woman to speak in tongues.
This is indeed original... and incredibly stupid.
The book of Acts insists that both women and men shared in the Pentecostal glossolalia. The "all" of 2:4 obviously included women, cf. 1:14. The quotation of Joel (in Acts 2:17f) highlights the participation of both genders ("sons" and "daughters," "male and female slaves").
However you take it, 1 Corinthians 14:34-36 does run against the fact that women are allowed to pray or prophesy in chapter 11 (prophecy btw is the immediate previous topic in chapter 14). In v. 27, the word "man" which the author of the article italicises simply does not exist in the Greek text which has tis, "someone, anyone".
Goofier than the Watchtower.
The pentecostals will tell you its still going on today. The baptist will tell you the pentecostals are talking gibberish.
While I disagree with this conclusion, others have floated the opinion that Paul was disapproving of women speaking in tongues in the congregations. It is not a novel concept.
http://www.piney.com/TonguesIndex.html
http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/Psychology/char/speaking.htm
Justitia
