by bebu 20 Replies latest jw friends
This question is not "Do you believe in justice". The question is, do you prefer its existence? -- IOW, do you want it to exist, even if you don't think it does? If you believe that it exists, do you wish it didn't?
I believe in justice, but if I didn't I would still wish for it. How about you?
bebu
Justice? I believe in it. I've rarely seen it.
Do I wish it existed? Nope!
I think "justice" doesn't and cannot exist, at least in a perfect form. It is a human social concept and a construct that doesn't apply to reality. I think we all sometimes wish that "instant justice" existed, especially when we see someone commit a traffic violation and seemingly get away with it. I've often said, "Where's a cop when you need one." But then that wish only ever applies when it pertains to the other person and never ourselves.
Dave
Dave, I agree that instant justice is certainly non-existant. And I often want to see justice done now, rather than any time later.
But besides 'instant justice', would you prefer having the existence of an eventual perfect justice (that is actually redundant ), or not?
BTW people, I am not asking if you want God to exist, either... only justice.
bebu
Very interesting question.
I remember having thought, a couple of times, that I wished something like a "final judgement" to be true -- not for the "reward and/or punishment," btw, just for the clarity of light shed upon everyone and everything, every instant of history, every action, word and relationship -- for the better and the worse.
I have since come to appreciate better the obliteration of time -- the "shrug of eternity" as Arthur Koestler put it -- as the essential dark background for any elusive spot of human "light," including whatever we may call "justice".
Come true: a dream's nightmare?
the obliteration of time
Are you referring just to our own personal memories? Or whatever could be preserved (such as via history or archeology) by a society/humanity?
bebu
the obliteration of timeAre you referring just to our own personal memories? Or whatever could be preserved (such as via history or archeology) by a society/humanity?
Do you mean "either individual or collective memory"? Both, I suppose.
Do you mean "just human" (vs. divine retribution)? Well, yes, but (referring to your initial post) I now tend to think I don't wish foranything "more" either.
I'm inclined to see the notion of "divine retribution" as a projection of our sense of justice (the only possible "proof" for God, by Kant's "moral reason"). And "divine forgiveness," otoh, as a metaphor of oblivion. Possibly due to my Christian background, I definitely prefer the latter over the former.
Sometimes i wish that it existed, but i realise that it is just my own tendency to vengence talking.
S
Narkissos, what you are writing about also reminds me of Buddhism (as I've understood it). That is, to get rid one's self of suffering (frustration re justice, in this case) it's best to just get over one's desires altogether.
Satanus, do you feel justice is restricted to vengeance? I know people who deserve (imo) good things, or just even a fair wage.
Stories (fiction or non) that satisfy me (ie, don't get me depressed) typically have some kind of just resolution. (Just an observation on the side.)
bebu
Justice is a cool concept. Im thinking if it exist in my next life I will probably reincarnate to a insect, deservedly because of all the animals I've eaten. The good news is that insects have short life spans so Ill probably back to a reptile in a year or two. Then Ill probably be reborn as a human vegetarian in about 50 years. See you all then.
