How do Cults recruit and keep their members? (page 4)

The wanderer

Dear Ms. Jgnat:

Regarding your last thread that was posted, you
mentioned that you fully understood what a
Jehovah's Witness goes through even though
you were never a Jehovah's Witness to
begin with ... how is that so?

You honestly feel because of your longevity
on this board that qualifies you to under-
stand something so deep and personal even
though, you were never a Witness?

Can you honestly tell me what it is like
to lose your entire family and every
friend you ever had through the
practice of shunning?

Even though, you were never a Witness?

What it is to lose a loved one because
of there refusal to take a blood
transfusion?

Even though, you were never a Witness?

What it is like to become incarcerated,
have your wife sexually assaulted, lose
your property and everything you have
ever known?

Even though, you were never a Witness?

I will admit you are an intelligent in-
dividual and you perform your job well
on the discussion board.

But an individual who has not spent real time
as a Witness cannot convince me that they have
a full grasp and understanding of what it is
like to be a Jehovah's Witness.

No disrespect intended but that is the
viewpoint I personally hold.

Respectfully,

The Wanderer

Gerard

A cult will convince you that you are in a bad situation, and then provide you "the remedy" in exchange of loyalty.

Gerard

Intelligence is no protection.

I dissagree, a trully intelligent person will inform himself/helself from other sources before engaging. Yet, I know of a few brilliant people getting sucked into cults so there's more than intelligence and information as defense.

g

Tigerman

wanderer . . . .are you presently a Jehovah's Witness ?

parakeet

wanderer: "Can you honestly tell me what it is like to lose your entire family and every friend you ever had through the practice of shunning? Even though, you were never a Witness? What it is to lose a loved one because of there refusal to take a blood transfusion? Even though, you were never a Witness? What it is like to become incarcerated, have your wife sexually assaulted, lose your property and everything you have ever known? Even though, you were never a Witness?"

I was a JW for almost 15 years, yet I never experienced any of the scenarios you list above. Does that mean I, as well as jgnat, are unqualified to comment about JW cult psychology? And before you tell me, as you did another poster, that this conversation is between you and jgnat alone, let me remind you of your statement in your initial post:

"Please add your viewpoints and commentary so that all may learn."

free2beme

All cults fit in these steps, not just Witnesses, Mormons or other extreme religions groups.

1. Make is looks wonderful, with lots of love for new people and inviting them to enjoy the positive nature of the faith (get together's, positive comments on their comments, talks or actions)

2. Study with them the basics (No comments on judicial committees, apostates, or negative in any way)

3. Keep them busy (So busy that they loss connections with other parts of their lives; friends, family, hobbies, work related issues, etc.)

4. Slowly add guilt (Make comments about change, make them want more positive, make them want to be more like you).

5. Get them to commit (Baptism, regular attendance, get them to move away from people they felt connected too, but were not of the faith)

Now you have them, job done.

DannyHaszard

It is not something that you can experience through a second or third party, nor something, that you can read and find in a book.

I have compared it to substance abuse alcoholism you had to have been there to comprehend it.

Likened the cult dynamic to spousal abuse wife battering (why don't she just leave the creep?) but on a large scale the same dynamics come into play dependency/dread also described as 'stockholm syndrome'.

jgnat

Q. Regarding your last thread that was posted, you mentioned that you fully understood what a Jehovah's Witness goes through even though you were never a Jehovah's Witness to begin with ... how is that so?

A. I do, so it must have happened. Can you explain it?

Q. You honestly feel because of your longevity on this board that qualifies you to under- stand something so deep and personal even though, you were never a Witness?

A. This board does not suffer fools. You might have noticed. If I didn't know what I was talking about, I would not have lasted. I do become personally and deeply involved with the hurting here. I want every exiting witness to succeed. I want the lovelorn to wade their way through their entanglements. I want the abuse to stop.

Q. Can you honestly tell me what it is like to lose your entire family and every friend you ever had through the practice of shunning?

A. No, I can't. But I've seen it, and I can empathize with it. Did you? In school I was the odd-speaking immigrant who was shunned by my school chums. I've had to walk away from abusive in-laws and cut off all contact. My mentally ill mother cut my picture out of all the family albums. She has spouted hatred right in my face. We've reconciled, but it took a few years.

Q. What it is to lose a loved one because of there refusal to take a blood transfusion?

A. No. Did this happen to you? I have, however, progressively lost my son to mental illness, and had to stand helplessly by as he descended to drug abuse and homelessness. He, also, is doing much better today.

Q. What it is like to become incarcerated, have your wife sexually assaulted, lose your property and everything you have ever known?

A. No. Did this happen to you? I was beaten to a shell of my former self by an abusive ex-husband. It took a few years to rebuild from that.

Q. But an individual who has not spent real time as a Witness cannot convince me that they have a full grasp and understanding of what it is like to be a Jehovah's Witness.

A. Neither do you. You are colored by your experience, which is different from others. And I do attend services on occassion. I talk to a real Witness daily. I live it daily, even today.

Q. No disrespect intended but that is the viewpoint I personally hold.

A. A viewpoint, in my opinion, prematurely concluded. Intelligence is only marginally helpful when dealing with the hurting. There has to be a high element of empathy. I cannot assume to know all. I must listen, listen very carefully. I do take offence to your analysis of the Watchtower. You state the problem as if it is resolved at the outset. I do think you are missing critical elements in your analysis. You'd do better to listen to veterans like me, rather than dismiss me.

jgnat

Gerard: I dissagree, a trully intelligent person will inform himself/helself from other sources before engaging. Yet, I know of a few brilliant people getting sucked into cults so there's more than intelligence and information as defense.

You helpfully made my point for me, thanks! I've noted that some brilliant people became witnesses. I, myself, an honors student, was sucked in to a bad marriage. All my intelligence did for me was build more powerful self-deceptions. There is something else at work, that is for sure. At some point, people convince themselves that a bad choice is good for them.

OnTheWayOut

Wanderer,

Your original question in the title is about cults in general, not JW's.
Read Steve Hassan's COMBATTING CULT MIND CONTROL. He was never a JW.
Steve was a Moonie, but he has used his experience to benefit others in many cults.
He recognized the wonderful tool that former members are in exit-counseling others.
First-hand experience is a great tool. The guy on "America's Most Wanted" lost
his son to violence and dedicated his life to stopping those kinds of people. But keep
in mind that MOST detectives and police officers were not victims of violent crime nor
were they criminals. They developed their skills and many consulted with victims and
ex-cons.
That said, Steve Hassan has developed many other tools.

Read some of his experiences and you will see that there are people with the education
and/or understanding and/or compassion to totally relate to victims. Yes, he WAS the
victim of a cult, he HAS special insight, but was NEVER a JW. Still, with his skills, I would
rather be counseled by him than by any JW I have met so far. I am sure that there are many
counselors/therapists that were never cult members, but could help out cult members.

You will also be amazed that there are many techniques within the WTS that are mild uses
of common mind-control cults. Of course, there are many people out there who can help.

How do Cults recruit and keep their members?

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