That's Technological Singularity http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technological_singularity .
We are looking at the Heaven Scenario, by Ray Kurzweil.
ni'o(New Topic) I just want to clear some things up.
Determinism: I've heard from some people that there are Jehovah's witnesses that are not Determinists, I don't know if that's true but here is a simple proof anyways.
Premise: Things that exist were caused.
Premise: All things are made from elementary particles.
Premise: Elementary Particles exist.
Conclusion: All things were caused.
note: There is the Heisenberg Principle which people sometimes try to relate to determinism. However it simply states that it's not possible to measure both the speed and location of an Elementary particle at the same time, this does not mean that Elementary particles don't from their perspective have these properties and exist.
Conclusion: Hard-Determinism (everything was caused from the beginning of the universe) is true.
Determinism means that there is no freewill. That means that past mistakes are unavoidable, it also means that mistakes made in the future are unavoidable. However as humans we can remmber our past mistakes and avoid repeating them, as well as think ahead to prevent from making them.
Hope we got through all that alright.
no'i(Old topic)The Singularity.
Premise: The Singularity will allow all the prophecies of the bible come true.
Conclusion: The return of "Jesus" will happen around the time of the Singularity(Singularity is theorized to occur by 2048).
I'm interested in people giving me quotes from the bible that contradict this view.
I also would like to point out that this would mean that we can merge with Science, and therby the rest of society, as they will experience the Singularity, the question is will they be able to handle the social revolutions that are going to occur because of the ever increasing exponential growth of technology?
Please comment .ui(happiness).i(and)koGLEkiko(be happy AND be the one that makes yourself happy).
Sincerly, LOkadin.
Singularity Jehovah's Determinism
by LOkadin 14 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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LOkadin
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myelaine
he he he...fokyc...a formatted world is easier to understand tho.
love michelle
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daystar
What happens to the Witnesses should such an event occur will be negligible in relation to everything else. Why should I care? Either they are part of the singularity, rapidly becoming cyborgs of some sort, or they are superceded by it, just like everyone else.
I rather like how it was depicted in the film A.I.
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fullofdoubtnow
Hope we got through all that alright.
Well, I read it easily enough, but that's all.
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LOkadin
I didn't know where to start with bible passages as all of them are excellent for Singularitarian interpertation.
Revelation 1 (Young's Literal Translation)
Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
Public Domain
[A Public Domain Bible]
Revelation 1
1A revelation of Jesus Christ, that God gave to him, to shew to his servants what things it behoveth to come to pass quickly; and he did signify [it], having sent through his messenger to his servant John,
(the events that pass must do so quickly, which they will as the Singularity dictates
2who did testify the word of God, and the testimony of Jesus Christ, as many things also as he did see.
3Happy is he who is reading, and those hearing, the words of the prophecy, and keeping the things written in it -- for the time is nigh!
(nigh from perhaps gods perspective .ui.u'i(happyily amused) Though it really is near for us with the Singularity and all.)
4John to the seven assemblies that [are] in Asia: Grace to you, and peace, from Him who is, and who was, and who is coming, and from the Seven Spirits that are before His throne,
5and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the first-born out of the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth; to him who did love us, and did bathe us from our sins in his blood,
(Just notes that Jesus Christ was the first to be born from the non-living, seems as though he must have been constructed from "dead"(non-biological) matter rather than evolved biologically(through fertilization). Don't know what they mean by blood at this point, could be anything as they have just stated he is not born of living.)
6and did make us kings and priests to his God and Father, to him [is] the glory and the power to the ages of the ages! Amen.
(Humans get to be kings and priests, and Jesus Christ gets glory, and power to "ages of the ages".
Power is needed to be able to connect to a Singularity network and glory is required to do well in one(It's a complex form of society that forms based on contribution to the network, if you are glorious for producing many things, then people don't mind doing things for you like creating specialized programs not of your field and other perks.
If we have a deterministic universe, we don't have to believe that there are no external influences to our universe(I don't have the physics to back me up on this yet, but it's certainly possible by the views of some physicists) It is possible that there is perhaps in "space" or a deeper quantum level, particles we can influence that influence many other particles in the universe. Theroetically this is true with normal determinism, as the entire previous state of the universe generates the next, a small change makes a chaotic difference. There is a possiblity maybe with Quantum Entanglement, where two particles are modified in the same way at the same time to entangle them.)
In English is seems a little hard to understand, but I translated to Lojban where it is CEDrale'iCEDra translated as the same thing to simple english though with a direct translation would be "The era characterized by that which the set of what speaker describes as eras" This could be in reference to the fact that once we hit Singularity and thought will happen a lot faster, squeezing in way more events into a shorter period of time.
So say in 2030 with 1000USD 1999 dollars, you could get 10^17cps with estimatate for the functional representation of the human brain being 10^16cps (Ray Kurzweil) the amount of intelligence created per year would be approximatly equal to 10^26cps or 10^29cps which is roughly the estimate for all living biological human intelligence by mid 2040's you'll be able to get 10^26cps for a grand.
Although the quality of our thought will go up, so will the quantity. If you process the same amount of information as would 7 people in the same amount of time -- say you started fresh and spent $7000 in 2030. You would do 7 times as many things as any one person. So to you, a day would seem like a week. If we also take into account your increased ability to multitask and exist in multiple environments at the same time(invited to go to two places at the same time) -- this assumes you have digitized a large enough amount of yourself to do that in "VR").
)
7Lo, he doth come with the clouds, and see him shall every eye, even those who did pierce him, and wail because of him shall all the tribes of the land. Yes! Amen!
(The clouds part is pretty easy, here they are refering to nano-bot-fog, a sure sign of the Singularity.)
8`I am the Alpha and the Omega, beginning and end, saith the Lord, who is, and who was, and who is coming -- the Almighty.'
(A simple demonstration of Hard-Determinism, since lord is all that are now, all that were, and all that will be in the future. Meaning we are all a part of the lord. The lord could say be running as us a program universe on some part of their mind and generating our entire universe. I'd have to say the processor is in the style of DNA parallel processors. The current state of the universe is based on the interaction of the entire earlier state of the universe, if we use the Standard Model and Planck time.)
9I, John, who also [am] your brother, and fellow-partner in the tribulation, and in the reign and endurance, of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, because of the word of God, and because of the testimony of Jesus Christ;
(just describes John's exile to Revalation as being determined so he could get the testimony of Jesus Christ.)
10I was in the Spirit on the Lord's-day, and I heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, saying,
11`I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last;' and, `What thou dost see, write in a scroll, and send to the seven assemblies that [are] in Asia; to Ephesus, and to Smyrna, and to Pergamos, and to Thyatira, and to Sardis, and to Philadelphia, and to Laodicea.'
12And I did turn to see the voice that did speak with me, and having turned, I saw seven golden lamp-stands,
13and in the midst of the seven lamp-stands, [one] like to a son of man, clothed to the foot, and girt round at the breast with a golden girdle,
(son of man seems to refer to the being having a likeness to man.)
14and his head and hairs white, as if white wool -- as snow, and his eyes as a flame of fire;
(if you were constructed of nano-fog you could really do whatever you wanted with your appearance, the appearance was probably made just so an impact could be had on John. There may be symbolic meaning behind it, don't know if anyone figured it out yet.)
15and his feet like to fine brass, as in a furnace having been fired, and his voice as a sound of many waters,
(same as above)
16and having in his right hand seven stars, and out of his mouth a sharp two-edged sword is proceeding, and his countenance [is] as the sun shining in its might.
(same as above, also note projecting light from foglets wouldn't be at all hard if it was necessary.)
17And when I saw him, I did fall at his feet as dead, and he placed his right hand upon me, saying to me, `Be not afraid; I am the First and the Last,
18and he who is living, and I did become dead, and, lo, I am living to the ages of the ages. Amen! and I have the keys of the hades and of the death.
(To those still alive i have become dead, I am living to the perspective of "the ages of ages".
19`Write the things that thou hast seen, and the things that are, and the things that are about to come after these things;
20the secret of the seven stars that thou hast seen upon my right hand, and the seven golden lamp-stands: the seven stars are messengers of the seven assemblies, and the seven lamp-stands that thou hast seen are seven assemblies.
(That is very interesting. At first I was confused as to what this meant, anyways it's quite clear that the stars are remote controls, possibly holographic projectors, John was touched by the right hand, which contained the stars, would also explain the radiance, doesn't rule out foglet cloud though. The assemblies are also clearly nano-assemblers, factories that produce nanofog among other nano and even macro size objects. BTW nano technology exists even now, as do 3d printers, we just haven't reached the level of sophistication to create nano-factories. Lots of people are working on developing them and they are projected to exist by the mid 2020's.)
Anyways I could write more but i'll probably leave it for other sections.
Please feel free to ask for explanations, I can cite sources wherever you ask for them, I get confused sometimes what is considered General Knowledge and not.
I don't know if it's because it's an English translation, or because it was written like that in the Original, but it seems as though in many places the same thing was stated in past, present and future. This is the hallmark of translation from a tenseless language -- like Chinese or Lojban. In the future when learning becomes much simpler through extension of self through the computing medium (.i.e. translation software). I don't know if this goes for the rest of the bible, but it might be the case that it was translated from a logical language so as to convey the most accurate meaning, as decided by whoever determined those words.
We will probably want to learn a language in which everything you say can be understood in the exacty way you inteded it to be understood, basically unambiguity. What would be called for is a Logical Language.
Lojban is a logical language based on predicate logic and is completely unambiguous. http://lojban.org for more info (might be a picture of me on the front page there "Thursday nov 16, 2006").
Anyways my point is: there are a lot of fundamentalists against the growth of technology and the Singularity. What they are doing is simply denying christ and delaying his return. .a'odoJIMpe(I hope you are/were/will be an understander).
mu'omi'e.LOkadin.(over to you, my name is LOkadin) -
Narkissos
Hi again LOkadin (seems like the twin thread has been deleted).
The deepest convergence I can perceive between your theory and Revelation is a common ideal of clarity and transparency. Lojban (as other artificial languages) seems to be designed to prevent ambiguity which is an integral part of natural (or rather cultural) language (cf. Babel). The "new world" or "new city" of Revelation is, characteristically, crystal-clear, exempt of night and darkness.
Both imo are revealing of the essential totalitarianism and destructiveness of light. Darkness, secrecy, ambiguity, are necessary to the constitution of subjects with the ability and desire to communicate in the first place. Forbid them and "we" will dry away as a slug under the scorching sun.
Perhaps one day mankind will toast its humanity in a flash of cognitive light, long before earthly life is toasted by the literal explosion of the Sun... There's no hurry though.
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daystar
That's quite fascinating to me LOKadin. I understand your points, but I have nothing to add. You are quite beyond me, technically, as well.
Lojban... thanks for the resources.
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LOkadin
I was thinking that the Singularity colud give Jehovah's witnesses a new edge on spreading the teachings. If you give people scietific viable proof of how they will be able to reach immortality and all the promises are given to them by the bible. They are much more likely to believe.
Jehovah's witnesses while I take pride in the fact that they do not participate in politics. There is no reason they can not participate in science and the attainment of the Singularity, as the fullfillment of the prophecies is really the concern of Jehovah's witnesses if I'm not mistaken.
If perhaps the training material for door-to-door and phone-center Jehovah's included information about the Singularity, and scientific evidence for the bible, we would be able to gain more understanding and a larger following. Perhaps we will be able to save more people. Save from the false-religion.
If you are interested on working on attaining the Singularity now in ways other than evangalism. I have a project I am working on to create a new kind of development environment. More info on my site at http://lokiworld.org if you are interested in participating or asking more questions about how this true religion can become a religion of science and technology, please ask questions.
ta'o(by the way) technology does NOT mean heartlessness and anti-social behaviour, capitalism a primitive form of glory management(money) is the perpetrator. Metaphorical I know, I'll clarify later g2g.
