Your feelings seem appropriate having been in a controlling cult. Hopefully you can get to the place in your life to never let anyone have that kind of effect on you.
The news I've been waiting almost 12 years to hear
by Jesus Christ 24 Replies latest jw friends
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rekless
I always feel that it is best not to gloat over anyone's misery,
because you never know what is in store for you as you get older and in poor health.
He may be an asshole, and he may be getting his just deserts in your eyes, but
you may have to revisit your joy in the future. If you have no regrets go for the gloating.
I wish you the best whichever way you go.
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skyking
I do not think your post is the way people should feel., but there is an Elder in my past that I swear if the devil posses, the devil has his man. I find my self wishing this ELder was dead not just dead, but dying like the death you described. As his last thing he sees before he goes is the dozens and dozens of people faces laughing at him the faces of good people that lives he made more difficult just because he had the power.
Shame on me, I hope I can be forgiven because of the way I feel about this Devil MAN. Die Devil MAN, Die!!!
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Cellist
Proverbs 11:10 'When the righteous prosper, the city rejoices; when the wicked perish, there are shouts of joy.'
Cellist -
choosing life
Lovelylill
I appreciate your post. It is refreshing when someone actually learns the lessons of forgiveness. You are right when you say that this man is still holding power over JC. Even if they are just thoughts or feelings, there is no way to escape the effects they have on us. As we brood in hatred of another, the effects can only be to bring us discomfort and emotional damage.
I knew a friend who had an alcoholic father who was dying of the effects of many years of heavy drinking. Yet she refused to go and see him. Even when he was no longer there mentally, she would not go to say goodbye. She carried her hatred to her death. The ironic part was that she became a fairly heavy drinker herself and died a rather young death.
And nobody deserves to suffer terribly and die a slow death. To find joy in the suffering of another is not something to be proud of. I have known my share of abusive elders, but I couldn't wish that on them.
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Confession
JC, I'm glad this is working for you. I'm also glad to be a part of a forum where thoughts such as yours are understood and tolerated--even when many disagree.
LovelyLil, I think you are lovely. Your post was very moving to me.
Rebel8, I always enjoy your posts (and your helpful website), but I'll disagree with your statement that "forgiveness is a concept based in Xianity."
Islam also advances the importance of forgiveness, teaching that Allah is 'the most forgiving.' There is a story in the Hadith about how forgiving Muhammad was. He had gone to a city to preach Allah, but was mistreated by its residents, some even hitting him with stones. The account goes...
"When he took shelter under a tree, the angel of Allah visited him and told him that Allah sent him to destroy the people of Ta'if because of their sin of maltreating their Prophet. Muhammad (may peace be upon him) prayed to Allah to save the people ot Ta'if, because what they did was out of their ignorance."
Hindu sacred texts call forgiveness 'a great power' and the 'one supreme peace.' The following reminds me very much of Lil's expressions...
"Forgiveness subdues (all) in this world; what is there that forgiveness cannot achieve? What can a wicked person do unto him who carries the sabre of righteousness in his hand?"
You may also remember how Mahatma Gandhi forgave his assassin as he lay dying.
Regarding Jainism, I found this on Wikipedia...
"...there were times far back when great Thirthankars were in deep meditation, and others would harm them, they would be so deep in meditation that they would not be hurt. So when the thirthankar opened his eyes, he noticed the wounds and forgave them all. Therefore all Jains are supposed to be able to forgive anyone, no matter what happened."
The above is not an attempt to "prove" that forgiveness is superior to not forgiving. Only that it is far from being of Christian derivation. In fact, beyond religion, many psychologists have long taught the value of forgiveness to ones mental and physical health.
I suppose (as in so many other areas) we're all just put together differently. To some of us, hanging on to the hatred--delicious thought it may be--is like hanging onto heavy, emotional baggage instead of letting it go. Others perhaps don't feel it to be a burden, and maybe feel stimulated when hearing news of a hated person's pain.
Me? I choose the "let it go" option. Holding onto it just makes me feel like I've allowed my detractor to change the person who I am inside--with all the accompanying hostile thoughts.
Love,
Confession
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observador
Lovelylil, I read your post with much interest and, let me tell you, it's always refreshing to see things from a different perspective. If it was me, I'd probably choose the "let go" and "forget" option.
However, I do think that Jesus Christ is entitled to feel the way he does. Things are different for different people.
Thanks for your thoughtful message.
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rebel8
I'll disagree with your statement that "forgiveness is a concept based in Xianity."
I agree my post was inaccurate & I actually meant to come back and fix it earlier--I was actually thinking exactly what you posted about Islam.
What I meant to say was that, in my culture, IMO many people who insist forgiveness is necessary are doing so because of teachings once rooted in Xianity (even if it was generations ago). It's hard for me to imagine that most people in the US are espousing values taught by Hinduism etc. because they're not aware of them to begin with. I think when most (not referring to posters here) people give me the rehearsed version of the forgiveness requirement, it's because they've been taught that for a few generations--a leftover from their grandparents' church school or whatever.
- Is it healthy to be constantly angry? No, if it affects you physically or leads you to inappropriate behavior.
- Is it healthy to spend lots of your time/energy obsessing about bad things others have done to you for years and years? No. It would get in the way of happier things in life.
The way to get around those 2 things is to work toward acceptance. Acceptance is what is necessary for our own health, not forgiveness.
You can accept something without forgiving it. I have accepted tons of evils done to me--acknowledging they happened and moving past them--but I will never forgive them.
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lovelylil
Don't get me wrong everyone, I do believe that Jesus Christ has a right to feel the way he does. I was just relating my personal experience to show that if he had a different perspective on things it may help him heal from his past hurts. My only intention was to help JC heal and was not to preach to him or tell him he is wrong for his views.
It took me many, many years to get to that point with my father. And over the years, I had held onto hurt from other people. I just found that I was only hurting myself and continued to allow the people who hurt me to excercise control over me and my emotions. Every time I thought about the past hurt and abuse I would totally re-live the pain all over again and was just as angry as the day it happened. I too wished my father dead and used to tell people that I would not have peace UNTIL he was dead in the ground and I no longer had to deal with him. In a way, this became true when he died but I did regret wishing it on him.
Please don't ever think you are not entitled to be seriously angry and bitter at anyone who caused you tremendous pain in your life. I just believe that after a time, you have to "let it go" and move on and not allow the anger to control you and your emotions any more. Only then will you have true peace in your life. And I am wishing for JC to have peace in his life.
JC,
This is merely my opinion and no matter what you do, I wish you well, Lilly
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Dismembered
Greetings JC,
This verse that was pounded down into my head, is one I think is fitting for those "elder" bastards that now have the grim reaper lying in wait on their doorstep.
(2 Peter 3:4) and saying: "Where is this promised presence of his? Why, from the day our forefathers fell asleep [in death], all things are continuing exactly as from creation's beginning." [And shit I wasn't supposed to die! italics mine]
Dismembered