DID ANY ELDERS HAVE THEIR HANDS IN THE KH TILL?

by badboy 28 Replies latest jw friends

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  badboy

  ANY TAKERS?
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  NewYork44M

  I was accounts servant for many years. I did not see anything like that take place.
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  Amazing

  Generally this is an area where the local JWs are fairly honest. The Accounts are normally handled by a Ministerial Servant (I did the Accounts before and during the Elder arrangement). The Accounts are usually audited every 3 months by someone proficient in the activity who has been appointed by the Secretary. The cash contributions are supposed to be collected by the Accounts MS, and should be checked at the time of collection with a counter-signed receipt, with a copy to given to the Secretary. The cash literature payments are checked against the literature inventory receipt., which is counter-signed.

  However, the system can be cheated because often Elders do not understand the accounting procedures and fail to have the Accounts audited, or they fail to have somone counter-sign and collect a copy of the receipt for cash transactions (which include checks). Credit cards and direct deposits are not used. And, the system has been cheated.

  We had an Elder who was handling the accounts. This was during a time when the congregation was packed with Elders, so that was the only job left. He was taking money, and only paying necessary bills to keep the Hall running. Finally one day the Society wrote a letter because they were not getting their money. As a result of this, the Elders audited the Accounts, once they got past the Elder's resistence. They also learned that he was doing other things which disqualified him as an Elder. He was disfellowshipped. He took, as best as they could account, about $2,500.00. They did not prosecute him, and allowed him to make payments ... which he never made ... I suspect that money was tight for him after his wife divorced him.

  But, in 25-years and several congregations it was the only case I ever knew about where funds were stolen. Kingdom Halls generally run on tight budgets, and do not see the kind of cash flows that other Churches do ... but then again, they are not helping the sick and poor either. However, they have stepped up their contributions in recent decades to pay for Circuit Overseer cars, insurance, Society sponsored insurance for Kingdom Halls and CO cars, as well as making general contributions to the Society. Now, the Watchtower Society sees huge cash flows ... if one can believe the Dunn & Bradstreet reports.

  Jim Whitney
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  sspo

  30 years in it, never seen any stealing
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  jayhawk1

  The way I saw it work, we had two men, the account servant and an assistant count all money received. The account servant would keep the books and write out the deposit tickets and the assistant always did the bank deposit. That way the account servant couldn't make out a new ticket because he didn't have the cash and the assistant couldn't do it either, because although he had the cash, he didn't have a new deposit ticket.

  The only way money could have been stolen is if they was both in on it. I really doubt that would happen.
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  james_woods

  We had one case years ago in a small congregation in Oklahoma. This was considered a very isolated event, and the money involved was a small amount even then.

  Of course, I guess we are avoiding such gross items as the Judge's Cadillacs, overseas cruises, mansions, booze, courtesans...etc.
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  Outaservice

  Back in the late 50's we had an Elder (Servant at the time) who caught with his hand in the Till. It was hushed up to us Rank & File, so I do not know how much was taken, but he was not disfellowshipped. He was removed as a Servant.

  Outaservice

  I don't think the stealing starts until the money gets to New York!
• 

  jayhawk1

  Of course, I guess we are avoiding such gross items as the Judge's Cadillacs, overseas cruises, mansions, booze, courtesans...etc.

  Or the biggest scam of all. Kingdom Hall builds and rebuilds.

  1 Society dictates one congregation should become 2 congregations and needs a new building

  2 Society loans money to build new building

  3 Free labor on new building

  4 Congregation makes PAYMENTS WITH INTEREST back to Society

  5 Congregation deeds the building to the Society

  6 Should the societ decide to combine 2 congregations or share a building causing the sale of one building THE SOCIETY KEEPS THE MONEY from the sale

  Now that is one well thought out scam that has played out several times in the Wichita Kansas area.
• 

  Justahuman24

  Yeah I never understood that. Why don't the Witnesses complain? I mean, they're paying to the Society for something that belongs to the same Society to which they are paying. In other words, the Witnesses are just renting the building; a building which they worked on, built and clean and pay to use it, yet it's not theirs. Doesn't seem fair.

  justahuman - but super nonetheless
• 

  New Worldly Translation

  In other words, the Witnesses are just renting the building; a building which they worked on, built and clean and pay to use it, yet it's not theirs. Doesn't seem fair.

  LOL. Yeah but don't try and tell 'em. All the Jw's I've talked to about it think they do own the KH. I'm not sure how they think this would in practice anyway; cong disbanded or taken into another hall, hall sold off and the proceeds divvied up between all the publishers? Not likely. Churches work in the same way in that it's paid for by donations but the cong don't actually own it. The difference is that churches are often useful public buildings for community activities and secular clubs etc, whereas KH's are off limits apart from the dissemination of the orgs own variety of BS.

  As for JW's with their hand in the till I've only had one experience of that. The accounts servant had been taking money from the contributions to pay for various things (he was a pretty poor chap) and I believe with the full intention of paying it back. Anyway he got demoted to publisher and that was that, which was fair enough I suppose.

  JW's are an honest bunch by and large, probably cos of reading My Book Of Bible Stories and the tale of Achan and all his family getting stoned (with rocks (the big hard stoney kind)) for nicking stuff.