What is going ON?

by Aintthatcute 32 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Aintthatcute

  First of all: I am new and have been lurking for about 2 weeks. Whoow! Glad I got that out of the way.
  Something that really bothers me is: When they say that the GB all the way down, Elders, and Ministerial servents are "Appointed" by Jehovah, and are deserving of "Double Honor". Okay, i've read this in the Bible, but here's my story:

  This guy I know who married one of my wife's childhood frieds was very well known in our circuit. He had many privileges, and after getting married, he was appointed a Ministerial servent. Well, one day his wife moves back in with her parents. (Naturally raising the enquiring eye-brows of her childhood congregation.) Her parents, later revealed that this guy had been with a women before he had married their daughter, and gaining privileges too. (You don't ask questions with topics like these, you just listen.) Now, he had been in the "Truth" from a young age, so, you could say he knew the consequences. My question is this:

  "Why did Jehovah appoint him as a Ministerial servant?" Dosen't this go against all that the WT has taught people about Jehovah, the Bible, and Jehovah's ways?

  I need answers to this. I have a few more, but will post later if that is OK?

  PS. I've posted this earlier in "RE:How you know this ain't the truth"
• 

  MrMoe

  Read Crisis of Conscience - the book is insight from Ray Franz - a former member of the Governing Body. They are not appointed by holy spirit - they are elected because they got noticed. The Governing Body does not pray over each appointed elder either - which is discussed in the book Crisis of Conscience.
• 

  Yerusalyim

  Even if God did appoint him (which I seriously doubt) we still have this thing called free will, and are free to act upon it. All of us are sinners. The church (mine is Catholic) has a divine mission, but is made up of humans, and humans tend to mess things up. That you're questioning the society is good, GREAT EVEN. But I recommend questioning doctrine rather than the actions of the so called APPOINTED and ANNOINTED.

  YERUSALYIM
  "Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
  [Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
• 

  Gozz

  ATC, welcome to the board.

  The elders who recommend one for a 'priviledge' don't have to pray. All that has to be done is for you to be spiritually strong. And the definition of that spirituality is what's written in your monthly report card, plus slamming some cool comments during the meetings, and being a little bit nice and then not being antagonistic to them elders, you know, all the 'widening out' works... Then you get appointed by humans, not by God's spirit. The 'appointed by Jehovah' angle is put to members to stop them from questioning whatever they may seems wrong.
• 

  ashitaka

  "Slamming some cool comments"-very funny, a good way of putting it.

  True, though.

  LOOK AT ME! I GAVE A THREE MINUTE ANSWER ON THE SIGNIFIGANCE OF THE ROBE JOB WORE! I STUDY WT PUBLICATIONS 6 HRS PER NITE, DON'T OWN A TV, AND CAN'T EVEN GROW FACIAL HAIR. GIRLS? WHO NEEDS 'EM?! I CAN TAKE THE AID BOOK TO BED WITH ME-OR A BOUND VOLUME! APPOINT ME! EMPOWER ME!

  ugh.
• 

  NameWithheld

  Aintthatcute: This really is one of the more common ways that the entire sham of "god's one true org" is exposed to many people. The fact that you are taught that god himself 'appoints' these people to 'shepard' you (which in reality most people fear being targeted by the elders for some 'sheparding' ). Then you see the vast amount of corruption in that arrangement, wherein men take advatage of the position they are given - "Don't question MY actions, I'm an ELDER". And as much as most JWs would love you to believe these are 'isolated' incidents done by a 'few' bad apples, the fact remains that we have seen this same story played out a million times over. Just about any JW in the org for a few years has tasted this.

  The reality - this is a man made religion, using a man made arrangement of control. Man being what he is takes advatage of the situation. End of story.

  Your decision you face is what to do with this revelation?
• 

  Aintthatcute

  YERUSALYIM,

  Sorry, didn't think I was questioning free-will or the individual. In fact, I'm glad that the issue is in front of him and not inside anymore. My concern is not of the nature "We are all sinners" that is a givein' concept. The doctrine (I think you want me to question)"
  -------------------------------------------------------------------
  But I recommend questioning doctrine rather than the actions of the so called APPOINTED and ANNOINTED.
  -------------------------------------------------------------------
  I'm not sure what you mean? You see, the appointment for ones to the position of an Elder, or Ministerial Servent is based on scriptures the WTS uses. In other words, the appointed individual(s) are to be clean of defilements etc,.

  I'll so some more checking on this and thanks for you thoughts.
  ATC
• 

  You Know

  Honoring men who serve in a position originally arranged by Jehovah is actually honoring God. It doesn't mean that some individuals who might occupy that position are necessarily worthy of honor. Look at the case of King Saul. He was hand-picked for the kingship by Jehovah's prophet Samuel, and yet Saul became a petty tyrant. David, who became a national hero and was picked to replace Saul as king, nonetheless, showed respect for the positon of one anointed by Jehovah. So, he didn't take matters into his own hands but waited on God to handle the matter, which of course he did.

  Look at the case of Judas too. Jesus spent the whole nght in prayer to God before he chose his 12 apostles, and yet one of those specially chosen men became a thief, and eventually he even betrayed the Son of God. Other first century elders became apostates too, or in the case of the Corinthian elders whom Paul sarcasticlly referred to as "super-fine apostles, were apparently only interested in honoring themselves. Paul wrote that in a large house there are all sorts of vessels---"some for an honorable use and some for a doshonorable use." So we are assured that there are men who are unworthy of honor of any sort. That doesn't men that the organization as a whole is not useful to God though.

  What we are facing with the collapse of this system of things is the ultimate judging, first and foremost, of those within God's household. The Scriptures say pointedly that the teachers among us "will recieve a heavier judgment." That pretty mauch guarantees that Jehovah will set things straight and it may not be a particulary pleasant experience for those involved, which is pretty much all of us. I expect to see a large body of elders dishonored, even with a double portion of dishonor, not by men, but by the Almighty Judge of us all. If you don't think Jehovah has the will and the way to do it, you don't know Jehovah. / You Know
• 

  Aintthatcute

  MrMoe,

  Thanks, where can I get a copy of "Crisis of Conscience?"

  ATC
• 

  MrMoe 2

  You Know likes to hear himself talk. blah blah blah. What a clown. Smile You Know - Jesus still loves you!