Question, What will happen to the earth and the Animals?

by unbaptized 39 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  unbaptized

  Hello Skyking,

  When I spoke regarding the Third Heaven, I was speaking of Paul and the other anointed brothers, sisters who have the Heavenly hope. I know that other religions teach doctrine with similarities to the Holy Bible and the Gospel od Jesus Christ, but they are not inspired by the God of the Hebrews and Christians. I'm not closed minded about other doctrines not related to the Holy Bible, but I feel confident that the Holy Bible is all a man needs to be fully equiped to do God's will. 2Tim 3:14-16

  To me Skyking, a lot of Jehovah's anointed followers had experienced a Third Heaven experience. For example, King David stated that he would not raise his hand against the anointed of Jehovah even though God gave him the opportunity to fight back. King David being in a very close relationship with God knew that it was Jehovah who appointed Saul and it should be Jehovah who removes him. His trust and relationship with God was that powerful to him, it was like Jehovah was right there with David. The same thing goes for Moses, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and Joseph. They all experienced Third Heaven like events, which directed them and taught them how they should act and live. The scriptures even says that Moses spoke face to face with God. But we know Moses did not really see God physically, but he say God from a Third Heaven prospective.
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  unbaptized

  Hello Lilly,

  You said, Can you show me one text that says some Christians will rule over others? There is no such thing.

  The scriptures in Revelations 20:6 states the Christ and his brothers will be priest and kings in Heaven and will rule for 1000 years. The bible say's the earth will continue in existence forever, so it's safe to say that it will be inhabited by righteous humans who will be the subjects of God's new government. Those who are anointed aren't going to Heaven to enjoy Heavenly life, they are going there to serve God and those on earth.

  That's why I asked if all good christians are going to heaven with Christ to rule, who will be our subjects on earth since there will be no one here?
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  unbaptized

  They also teach the future testing time when Satan is loosed again is another test for Christians? That means 3x we are tested. No, the future testing time is for unbelievers AFTER they are given opportunity to accept Christ

  I have to disagree Lilly, the scriptures plainly says that all will be tested when satan is released from captivity after the thousand years. As far as the number of test is concerned I do not know, but what I do know is the scriptures do not lie. Revelations 20:1-8

  If they teach this teaching in Revelations 20:1-8 then they are correct!
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  unbaptized

  So you see, ONLY Christians recieve the reward of imortal life and the ability to go into the heavenly realm to be with Christ. The rest of mankind, although they will benefit from the Kingdom, and can attain life on earth again, are not given imortal bodies

  Lilly I agree with half of this statement, but then I disagree with the other half of this statement. The scriptures say's that Christ brothers will receive immortality when the go to Heaven the 144000 as stated in Revelations 20:4-6 Now the rest of mankind will remain on earth but in on a paradise earth as God intended in the begining.

  Also forgive me for the red ink. This crummy pc would allow me to change the color back until now! so forgive me for the red ink statement. I just wanted to highlight your point.
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  unbaptized

  Skyking,

  You said, There are more the seven such GOD MEN or as we call them Christ's that are said to have lived before Jesus

  I try to stick directly to the Holy Bible, if it's not in there I do not mess with it!
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  skyking

  I see your mind is closed. Paul would never of said 'Third Heaven' a concept that was totally different than yours. He was preaching to people that know already what the third heaven was. Much like how you assume the third Heaven is a concept the way you have been taught it is. A very narrow way of thinking.

  You need to study what the real history is of the first century or you too scared to find out? Until you sweep away the old chains that binds you, you will never know the truth. Like Job's thinking he was going to live as a Ghost on earth with God. He was wrong or was he?

  Also just to open your mind will you at least post one more time and tell me what you think is going on with the God men 'Christ's' that the Pagan's religions wrote about long before Jesus.
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  lovelylil

  unbaptized,

  This is the issue we mainly disagree on. I totally agree that one day in the future righteous people will live on the earth with Christ as their king. However, these are not Christians but unbelievers who will learn righteousness from Christ and his "anointed" believers. Remember how the WT said we (believers) will teach those who are resurrected back to earth? That is correct. Now, if you are going to teach others, then you are a believer already correct? If you are a believer, then YOU have already been declared righteous by your faith and belief in God's Son. He is YOUR high Preist and has already made amends for your sin. Understand?

  My question was this: where does the Bible show Christians ruling over other Christians? It does not. It shows Christ's brothers (who make up the church) and is composed of ALL believers in him ruling over other "righteous" people on the earth. The problem the WT has is they do not believe that Christ is going to TEACH righteousness to ALL of mankind.

  2 In the last days
  the mountain of the LORD's temple will be established
  as chief among the mountains;
  it will be raised above the hills,
  and all nations will stream to it.

  3 Many peoples will come and say,
  "Come, let us go up to the mountain of the LORD,
  to the house of the God of Jacob.
  He will teach us his ways,
  so that we may walk in his paths."
  The law will go out from Zion,
  the word of the LORD from Jerusalem

  The WT tries to apply this to the kh and their meetings. This is a prophecy for the future state of mankind. Notice "many peoples" go up to learn about God? If this applies to Witnesses and no one else, WHY are they being instructed about God's ways? Don't they already know about God's ways. This teaching is for the rest of mankind, who are NOT Christian believers. Note the judgement of the nations during that time;

  Isaiah 2:4
  He will judge between the nations and will settle disputes for manypeoples. They will beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks. Nation will not take up sword against nation, nor will they train for war anymore.

  The above scene is picturing the converting of WHOLE nations to God. Not just individuals.

  Who are these nations being spoken of here? currently unbelievers, but God will open their hearts to him, just like he does with true believers and help them learn his ways. They will ALL learn righteousness, Then they will get to live in peace on earth. None of these ones are of the heavenly calling, they will remain on earth forever. Any who refuse to learn righteousness will be cut off. The narrow view of most religions is that only if you belong to their Christian group will you survive long term. This is a lie and shows God as vengeful and unmerciful. He vowed to save ALL mankind thru his son and will do that in the future. The church (Christian belivers) are saved now by Faith in Christ. And they recieve the greater heavenly reward.

  The rest of mankind will be addressed following this time period known as the "gospel age". It is for the gathering of those "in Christ" only. The JW's will readily accept the kingdom when it comes to earth but the WT organization is limiting them to earthly hope when IF they are beleivers in Christ they can still go to him for "imortal life" in heaven. And can be part of the ruling class of the kingdom. Peace, Lilly
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  skyking

  You posted while as was responding. So you believe only the bible my hunch was correct. Are you to scared to find out about the GOD MEN? The stories are real, no doubt these GOD Men never lived. But they were Christ's just as real to those followers of their faith as Jesus is too you. You can not disregard these stories just because the bible does not mention them, no more than you can say that America does not exist because the bible did not mention it. Remember Paul said he preached to the whole inhabited earth and all the earth went to Pharo for grain. But yet America and Australia existed. Despite this.
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  lovelylil

  Skyking,

  I did research on the Mysteries teachings. There are some who claim that these teachings borrowed from the Jewish old testament prophecies about the coming Messiah and thus based their characters on him. The OT does prophecy about the son of God, born of a virgin, who dies and comes back on the 3rd day, and contains all the other information found in the Mystery religions. Some also say there are much more differences than similarities between the mystery religions and the NT. I'm not saying which view is correct, just trying to show there are other experts who reject this view as false. Also much of the bible was passed down for many generations, we don't really know how many before it was written down. So we cannot really trace the origins back far enough to see which came first, the mystery teachings or the Bible.

  About the Bible:

  I mentioned this on another link at that is that the Bible is an ecclectic mix of different types of books. There are prophetic ones, geneologies, historical records, poetry, allegories, and much more. Not all of it is to be taken as literal. And yes, a lot of the words and imagry in the Bible was pulled from other ancient writings and used to teach a point and why wouldn't it be? It was written for an ancient audience and so it was written in language they would already be familiar with. For like you said, there were many ancient books around at that time, which wrote about similar things. That being said, there is a wealth of information that is useful in the Bible and practical for our day. And the overall principles in it can still apply although it is an ancient book. Even if you do not believe in a personal God. The problem with some Believers is they give equal wieght to all the books of the bible and consider it all prophetic or written by God's order when this is not the correct view. Much of the Bible was written by men according to their own perspectives. but they were "inspired" by God and wrote what they felt moved by thier faith to write. This does not mean we should throw the Bible out but only to balance our view of it. I'm sure you can agree with that? I

  I would recomend to some (like unbaptized) to read other ancient books and histories like Josephus to get a better understanding of the Bible. Even Josephus (well know ancient Jewish historian) writes that some of the Bible is allegorical or written ambiguously, so we don't know if it is literal or not. That being said, most people know I do believe in God, although I admit myself that no one really knows "what" God is. The bible writers struggled with the concept of God just as much as people today do. I understand how you feel and others when some people try to say they know everything or have ALL the truth. When they really are not even scratching the surface of it. Just wanted to let you know I am hearing what you are saying.

  Unbaptized,

  I was not trying to be dogmatic in my responses. Just trying to show there are other ways of viewing the scriptures. The Main idea I get from the Bible is that although at one time God favored the Jewish nations - Jesus broke down all the barriers between them and the gentile peoples. God is no longer partial to any particular nationality. But accepts all men who do what is right. That includes all people in the world, not just JWs' or Christians or anyone else. No one group as a "corner" on God. And his plan (if you believe in it) is to save ALL mankind. Not just Christians. If we preach God is Love, then how can we believe anything else? It would offend my sense of justice to save only a select few when I know I am God and have the power to open peoples hearts and minds to accept me, and yet I don't do that and destroy them anyway. Think about it, If you believe the Bible is God's word, and if the Bible does not contradict itself and it plainly states "God IS Love", then those who believe in a narrow salvation plan MUST be wrong. Or, the Bible is false. Which one would you pick? Peace, Lilly
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  dark angle

  "Trust In Jehovah." He will probably move us all to another galaxy (or something) in a great galactic battlestar capable of defeating Satan and Darth Vader, before the earth is burned up by the Sun, Moshe. It will probably be like a great Noah's Ark in outer space and Jehovah's chosen people will be the first ones in existence to live forever, with God and Jesus and the 144K all smiling up from 7th Heaven at the chosen ones. hahahhahah i find that answer interesting! might also make a great movie epic!