If you designed a faulty artificial heart, or made a faulty program for a computer, who would you blame? Yourself of course! But evil and dysfunction are somehow our fault, right. Even though we had no intelligent hand in our own design. If you created a loving, kind being and placed it in an evil, corrupt and selfish world, like a dog without a bone, and then that loving being started to become resentful because it was unable to see the blessings and joy and majesty of your creation, would you blame the being you made, or yourself? I could never understand people who continuously give credit and praise to an entity they can't see, doesn't talk to anyone, does absolutely nothing for anyone, lets evil thrive, and gives no protection or advantage to those that try to be decent. None of my prayers have ever been answered, and any changes that ever happened in my life were from a painful, willing and deliberate effort, on my part, to do so. Praise God? Praise yourself! In Nazi Germany during the holocaust, a boy watched his father calling on the great Jehovah, praying feverently to stop the injustices to the Jews, and save his family from evil. After his prayer was finished he received a nice clean bullet, right between the eyes, by his Nazi captor. Even if this evil was supposed to be part of some great plan for the vindication of God's name, it's still sadistic and egocentric, as we are being used as pawns to prove some point. I get far less angry in life when I leave god out of the equation. The way I see it, god and satan are just added complications that perpetuate problems that should be dealt with in the real world. If I chose to be good, and reject God and satan at the same time, then they both lose, and that gives me satisfaction! Besides, If I try my best to be good in this sick world, of my own free accord, and god wants to destroy me, then he can kiss my ass from here, to the other side of eternity.
Should God be Held Responsible for the Evil that Men Do?
by The wanderer 51 Replies latest jw friends
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Deputy Dog
wanderer
Doesn't God claim responsibility for the Evil that men do?
Isa 45:7
I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am the LORD, that doeth all these things.Job even says: "What? shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil?"
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Tyrone van leyen
If that's correct Deputy Dog then we are just part of a big game for his cosmic amusement with no real control over our own affairs. At any rate I refuse to be a part of this stupid game. He gives us a book thats supposed to help us and more evil and confusion and interpretations come out of it. I'm not playing anymore!
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free2beme
To me, a group of people who believe in one thing can have the power to create a god of the mind. A mental level of thinking, that makes that God real to them and thus brings about certain mental and physical manifestations of that God. In so doing, they pull from the mental powers of the mind to be the God within, and thus they also hold the responsibility of god in their own organization. So do I blame God or am I holding God responsible. Depends on what God your talking about? If it is the God the Witnesses created, yes, I think there is some blame that their God has to be willing to shoulder.
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Tyrone van leyen
Isn't every idea that comes out of our heads a god we have created. That may all be an illusion for our comfort or a means to justify evil. I'm talking about the force that made us. Personally, My logic tells me that an entity is responsible for all things that are in existence. What I question based on what I see, is that that entity actually gives a dam. Why should we trust, if he holds all the cards. We have no reason to. We want definitve and tangible answers to make us feel good. I call that wishful thinking.
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acadian
I find it sad, that instead of people taking responsibility for their own actions, they blame some one else for them... Irresponsible people always put the blame some where else, rather than taking responsibility for their own actions. If my children murder in my name, am I responsible? If my children allow bad things to happen to other people when they have the means to stop it and they don't, am I responsible? And if God did step in, who would be left? Have you never done anything to hurt some one else, anything? Cut me a break, and start being responsible for your own actions, and stop blaming your short commings on some one or some thing else. And if some one causes you harm, try putting the blame where it goes, on the man or woman who caused that harm, not God. I always find it stupid sounding when people say: "There can't be a God or he wouldn't allow suffering" For God to not allow suffering would mean taking YOUR FREEDOM of CHOICE away from YOU. And if you do not have freedom of choice, what are YOU, but a slave! I have the freedom to choose, either to do good or evil, I choose to do good, and if I, in any way harm another, I will take responsibility for the harm I do and not blame it on another as it would seem that most do. Like I said, pretty SAD!
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LittleToe
I'd like to offer two analogies:
- Should the President of the USA or the Queen or Prime Minister of the UK be held responsible for the evil that one of their citizens carries out?
- Should our parents be held responsible for our leg not working properly because we damaged it in car wreck, even if they taught us to drive and provided a perfectly servicable vehicle?
The reason I offer these particular analogies is because they address two of the main antagonisms that the original question raises. I.e. if God is powerful enough to do something, or if God made us this way, how come things are the way they are?
As for DDog's interpretation of Isa.45:7, I reject it as extreme HyperCalvinism.
I don't think we can hold anyone responsible for what evil we do but ourselves. Man is responsible for his actions and inactions, whether he is a deist, theist, atheist, pantheist or panentheist.
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avidbiblereader
Very well put LittleToe
abr
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Blueblades
No! We reap what we sow. As we sow, so we reap. Man collectively, we individually, are responsible for our own actions, whether we have a belief system or not.
Blueblades
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BlackSwan of Memphis
LT:
I see where you are coming from. I suppose I'm going at this with the idea of a person doing something in the name of God.
(Although how is it in the Name of God, when God is more of a title? )
As long as he either a) allows it to happen or b) doesn't make it perfectly clear to mankind, once for all time, that he isn't going to tolerate someone murdering and smoting someone else in His name, then, to me he bears responsibility.
To say he is responsible for all the ills of the world, I don't agree with as much. (I'm working out the details on this still)
As freetobe made the point, which God are we talking aboout. My frame of reference would be the God of the Bible (I'm still working out the details on my thoughts regarding deity or whatever as well). In that case, over the centuries, people have done a lot of nasty things in his name, in which case, yep They Most Certainly Bear responsibility for the actions.However, the fact that to me, God has remained silent, he might as well as given them his blessing.
The point that is made regarding the Queen of England or other leaders etc...
I would think that if mass murders were being committed in her name or for her, or in some respect doing these deeds in her honor, she (they) would not remain silent, but would rather come out and say "This is intolerable, I do not accept this at all." Rather then wait until thousands had perished and then come out and condemn it. (Although they would be dead.)
just my thoughts and ya know, the more I learn the more I grow, so .... I'm open to reading the thoughts on this topic (good thread topic Wanderer)