They don't have a forgiving enough, flexible spirit when it comes to issues of disobedience by their members. They are just too black and white in their approach too unsophisticated, indiscriminating and abrupt. They could have had a scale of punishments of which DFing would be the ultimate one. People treated understandingly are more likely to give up a wrong doing.
Would the WT club have mandated the prodigal son be shunned?
by LexWatson 29 Replies latest jw friends
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blondie
where one of them, thumping the bound volumes in front of him, demanded, "Don't you believe this is from 'faithful and discreet slave'?"
Ozziepost, I would have touched my Bible and said I believe this is from God and when what is in the publications from the "slave" is in harmony with what is in the Bible, I can depend upon it. (then in a sincerely sweet voice). You aren't suggesting that the publications are inspired or infallible? I wouldn't want to make God's word invalid by putting imperfect men's ideas ahead of the Bible.
Blondie
As to the prodigal son, the WTS puts the elders (as God's representatives) in the place of the father making the determination that the younger son is repentant. All other JWs would be pictured by the older son. Remember under the law, the younger son might have been guilty of a capital offense and could have been put to death. There was no provision for repenting and escaping death (except in the case of David and Manasseh, but then everyone can't be a king).
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Jourles
The WTS is usually pretty good about covering themselves, but did you notice something in these statements? ---
"While he was yet a long way off, his father caught sight of him and was moved with pity, and he ran and fell upon his neck and tenderly kissed him."
Compare that with:
no doubt has some idea of his son’s repentance by observing his sad, downcast countenance as he returns
the father ran to meet and then accepted his returning son. The father, seeing the lad’s pitiful condition, responded with natural parental concern.
This shows that when a Christian who has become wayward shows genuine repentance , Jehovah will feel pity and tenderly accept that one back.
First of all, the scripture says that the father felt pity as soon as he saw his son while he was yet "a long way off." The father didn't feel pity after running to see his son, but rather, as soon as he caught sight of him. How could anyone judge someone's repentance based on seeing them "a long way off?" No one can. The same could be said of a JC committee waiting for you to show up at the kh. Imagine them waiting on the kh street corner watching for your car. As soon as they see you driving down the road from a quarter mile away, they immediately judge you based on your facial expressions. No JC meeting required. Sound about right? Wouldn't this parallel the Prodigal Son story? Secondly, how many people do you know have cried during their JC meeting to avoid being df'd? Wouldn't that show repentance? Or could they just be faking it? It takes time to watch an individual to see whether or not they return to their prior sinful state rather than immediately judging them within an hour's time. So in this case, the father immediately accepted his son back without waiting for him to prove that he left his former acts of drinking/whoring.
Yep, the WTS definitely has it all ass-backwards. The bible has nothing to do with their df'ing policy. If it did, a party would be held to welcome the erring one back. And the deal about the clapping? I believe this decision was made due to not offend another in the hall if the df'd one did something against another person in the hall. Again, this goes against the PS story. What did Jesus say about the father's other son? Wasn't he pissed because his father held a party? And what did his father tell him? Basically, "suck it up bitch. your brother came home."
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blondie
Good expose, Jourles. It helps me see how the WTS resembles the Pharisees and the scribes of Jesus time. They seem themselves as being the authority and the power, and the Bible counts as nothing.
A ex-JW sent me an experience. It was during the last 2 months he attended meetings. The WT conductor asks the audience, "And what do we base our beliefs on?" as he held up the Watchtower. The PO was sitting in the back row and quickly raised his hand and grabbed the mike from the attendant as he said, "Brother WT Conductor, we base our beliefs on the bible." The WT Conductor put down his WT quickly and mumbled, "Yes, that is correct." Why be surprised then that the men who think they are in charge by God's permission easily twist their words to fit the organizational doctrine not the bible.
Blondie
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OnTheWayOut
There was no provision for repenting and escaping death (except in the case
of David and Manasseh, but then everyone can't be a king).I have always said- "It's good to be the King."
I recall that the WTS would love to put unrepentant ones to death,
and IMO, they allow for repentance only because even the best
faithful JW's would get kicked out (or put to death) if the allowance
wasn't there.Many JW elders are forgiven without a JC to decide their fate, I only
imagine the same or more for CO/DO/GB members.
It's good to be middle and upper managers in the cult.
Everyone else- watch out. -
juni
Blondie said:
Why be surprised then that the men who think they are in charge by God's permission easily twist their words to fit the organizational doctrine not the bible.
That is the bottom line.
Perhaps the "disgusting thing that causes abomination sitting in the Holy place" is the WTB&TS? They are so self assuming they'll never get it.
Juni
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Sad emo
Perhaps in the parable the WT is better represented by the other prodigal son - the one who hadn't physically left home but his heart was a long way away.
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fullofdoubtnow
A jw in the same position as the prodigal son certainly wouldn't be welcomed back to the kh in the same way. If he wasn't df'd, he most likely soon would be, unless the elders accepted that he was repentant, in which case he would have restrictions placed on him.
He might not completely shunned, unless df''d or da'd, but he would be treated with suspicion by the rank and file, and I doubt many would speak to him, apart from a quick hello.
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choosing life
The prodigal son is one of the best illustrations in the Bible. It shows that God is much like a loving parent. Anyone who is a parent can feel the relief and great happiness the father felt towards his son when he just caught sight of him returning. There is such a close and tender feeling we have for our children.
It really needs no explanation. That is why Jesus used it to teach us about forgiveness. I could never stop loving my children or make them earn my love. They already have it and we already have God's love. That is what Jesus is trying to tell us.
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Quandry
***w819/15p.29par.17IfaRelativeIsDisfellowshiped...***In Jesus’ parable of the prodigal son, the father ran to meet and then accepted his returning son. The father, seeing the lad’s pitiful condition, responded with natural parental concern. We can note, though, that the son did not bring home harlots or come with a disposition to continue his sinful life in his father’s home. No, he expressed heartfelt repentance and evidently was determined to return to living a clean life.
Of course the son did not bring home any harlots. The account says that his money was all gone.They would not have come with him. The account also states that he was hungry and so had no other recourse. The father could have used this information to really berate him, and lecture him on how things would be now, and make life hard for him. The facts show that he did not. He showed true love as a father to a son. What he had done was not even mentioned. It was past and not to be dwelt on anymore.
Contrast that with the JC. They hound and want every sordid detail, berate, and humiliate until the "sinner" feels no worth as a human. Then they must allow the congregation to show their disdain by disfellowshipping and shunning. This after the person has learned a lesson and humbled themselves, returning and asking for help.
It is obvious that the JC does not feel the fatherly love that they are supposed to as being shepherds of God, caring for the sheep.