The Watchtower justification for now allowing CIVILIAN SERVICE. (page 2)

IronClaw

Ask the guy who spent 10+ years in prison for a crime he didn't commit and then was let go due to new evidence? At least the system has the courtesy to say that they had the wrong guy and let him go.

The Claw

The young men of my generation faced the issue during the Korean conflict and thereafter. The draft was still existing. It was clearly understood by all in the congregations that any alternative service such as hospital work was clearly "a compromise." Some who chose this course were treated as marked individuals who would not have certain privileges within the congregation and were treated as compromised brothers.

It is just one more example of the vacillating position of the Watchtower on some issues and the cavalier attitude of the leaders in the organization.

Gayle

The young men back in the late 60's that went to prison because of the draft, then the rest of their lives have a prison record,,organizationally they had no choice, even to choose alternative service then,,I believe that most if not all would have accepted alternative service then,,I visited one brother in prison because of refusing the draft,, he was "grey" looking in there, depressing,, his mother was there visiting and she so wept. Back then the judges were starting to beg the young men to do alternative but they would be disassociated if they did that then. It is so nauseating and upsetting how they throw it out there that is was the brothers' themselves, their personal conscience back then. There are so many issues that the WT organization does not allow "personal conscience."

Stealth453

The Watchliar Sociopath Society.

That's the answer.

Terry

Watchtower 1998 August 15 p.17
“Feelings of Having Suffered Needlessly
In the past, some Witnesses have suffered for refusing to share in an activity that their conscience now might permit. For example, this might have been their choice years ago as to certain types of civilian service. A brother might now feel that he could conscientiously perform such without overstepping his Christian neutrality regarding the present system of things.
Was it unrighteous on Jehovah’s part to allow him to suffer for rejecting what he now might do without consequences? Most who have had that experience would not think so. Rather, they rejoice that they had the opportunity of demonstrating publicly and clearly that they were determined to be firm on the issue of universal sovereignty.”
How do the people that write these articles lie straight at night???

I was one of those who spent two years in Federal Prison.

After I received my notice from the local draft board to meet with them I went to the Congregation Overseer (that is what the presiding Elder was called back then).

Brother Beard (C.O.) and Brother Coulter (asst C.O.) met with me in the Kingdom Hall library.

We stood next to a filing cabinet and never sat down. There was a sudden hush and conspiratorial "tone". I felt strangely uncomfortable.

"Brother Walstrom, you can't ever tell anybody what we are about to discuss. The Society avoids direct confrontations with the Federal government at all costs. This is to be a matter of "personal conscience". You can't ever tell anybody that we or the Society has advised you or persuaded you in any way to make your decision. Understand?"

"Umm, sure."

"If you were to accept ALTERNATE service in the Civilian Sector you'd still be considered Government Property! Even though you were working in a hospital you BELONG to the Federal Government and that is part of Satan's plan to COMPROMISE your integrity. Understand?"

"Umm, sure."

"Right. You must REFUSE any compromise of alternative service or community work on the grounds that you belong to Jehovah's government and cannot serve any other government or else you'd be guilty of TREASON to Jehovah's kingdom."

"Okay."

"Tell the drafter board, or anyone else who asks, that it is your conscience which is telling you this because Jehovah's holy spirit is guiding you because of your going to him in prayer."

"Okay."

"You'll probably have to go to prison. There are alot of brothers in Seagoville over in Dallas. You'll have lots of fine fellowship and meetings to attend."

"How long will I have to be in prison?"

"Anywhere from 6 months or so to, probably, a maximum of a couple of years."

"How long does the average brother spend?"

"Ohhh....lemme see.....a couple of years, I think. But, with early parole you could be out in less than that."

"oh..."

Sobeit

This make me heart sick! Many of the young and middle aged men who went to prison in WWII, those that spent time in very high-risk prisons came out still looking over their shoulders for the guards. Even those than were sent to low-risk camps, came out carrying it in their "shoulders".

Then there was cruel rejection by former school mates, relatives and neighbors after being released. Of course, don't forget that most were on parole for a time afterwards and sometimes the draft board would be looking for ways to send them back to prison. One young man was sentenced twice, after he served four years, he was sentenced to another fours years.

I remember a man who went to prison in WWII and was in tears that his son was serving time in a very harsh prison during the Korean Conflict.

WWII was a response against a definite evil; and most definetly a terrible and cruel war. And the public had little sympathy for those that didn't serve.

compound complex

Greetings jwfacts,

Please see the following thread for point-by-point analysis of this issue in Ray Franz's IN SEARCH OF CHRISTIAN FREEDOM. The Branch Committees of most countries could NOT understand the unreasonableness of the Society's position, much less the hapless young brothers who could not even explain their stand to the authorities. The GB were absolutely unconcerned about future, needless suffering of the imprisioned brothers. The comments and concerns of mature and responsible overseas' elders - who clearly saw the irrational stand for what it was - went unheeded.

www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/126156/13.ashx - don't let the thread title throw you [JW Children --- Custody Cases] see also page 14.

Coco

stillajwexelder

I would, at the very least have much more respect for the Borg. if only they would, once say, " We were wrong".

Better still- We are SORRY, we were wrong

UnConfused

:: Was it unrighteous on Jehovah’s part ::

I like how they throw Jehovah under the bus!

Mary

Was it unrighteous on Jehovah’s part to allow him to suffer for rejecting what he now might do without consequences?

Um, where exactly do they get the idea that Jehovah had anything to do with their 2/3rds majority vote on this crap? I guess rather than accept responsibility themselves and admit publically that they were WRONG (yet again), that they can shift the guilt over to Jehovah. Ya, makes perfect sense.

Most who have had that experience would not think so. Rather, they rejoice that they had the opportunity of demonstrating publicly and clearly that they were determined to be firm on the issue of universal sovereignty.”

Ya riiiiiight.... ....Just like all those that didn't pay into their company pension plans "rejoiced" over getting screwed over, or just like I'm not bitter about the fact that I wasn't allowed to go to university. This is worse though. These brothers went to prison, not because God demanded this of them, but because the Governing Body members demanded it. And I'm curious as to how they know that "most" who suffered needlessly, aren't bitter about it now. Did they take a poll? Interview these ones? Offer their apologies for screwing their lives up? Something tells me that Bethel never contacted Terry to see if he was "rejoicing" over the two years he spent in prison due their bumbling interpretations of these stupid old goats. Jeezus....it just boggles the mind the crap they come up with.

The Watchtower justification for now allowing CIVILIAN SERVICE.