FuzzyPaul and the other "conspiracy believers": Thanks for all the Masonic info/links, etc.
As for the embedded images issue, you should find interesting this DVD-documentary re: embedded images in CATHOLIC literature and artwork:
http://www.rapeofthesoul.com/story.html
It's only $20 bucks and well worth it for those (and ONLY THOSE) interested in the subject of subliminal images.
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Just last week one S. Fla. Christian org, D. James Kennedy's Coral Ridge group, presented a documentary re: evidence for the Cross, the Resurrection, etc., entitled "Cross Purposes." In it they used lots of old Christian artwork from throughout the centuries. And one of the pictures I happened to recognize from the "Rape of the Soul" DVD mentioned above. So I went online a few days ago to see if I could find that crucifix online, and here are a few links:
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Various Pictures of the SAN DAMIANO Crucifix
http://www.franciscanfriarstor.com/stfrancis/stf_san_damiano_cross.htm
http://www.monasteryicons.com/monasteryicons/Item_San-Damiano-Crucifix_207_ps_srm.html
http://www.monasteryicons.com/info/san_damiano_cross.hzml
http://www.shrinesf.org/francis11.htm
http://www.inhisname.com/CrossImage/831.jpg
http://www.inhisname.com/CrossImage/NELST_6.jpg
http://www.poorclarestmd.org/sandamiano2.htm
http://www.bridgebuilding.com/narr/mi207.html
http://www.lcss.org/StB/images/SanDam02.jpg ,
sterling silver version:
http://www.mckaychurchgoods.com/sandamiano.htm
http://www.athanasiuscm.blogspot.com/2006/11/rape-of-soul-what-you-cant-see-can.html -- that is a Catholic blogger's site with clear, close-up pics, along with a text interview with Mike Calace, producer of "Rape of the Soul" DVD (very interesting details of events AFTER the release of the DVD, esp. re: that perv in Oregon who was commissioned by the RCC to draw those covers for Catholic "Missals" -- which you'll have to watch the DVD to understand what he is talking about).
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The above crucifix, and another one, the BIGALLO Crucifix (also shown in the "Rape of the Soul" DVD along with numerous other examples of embedded art) both show the underside of male genitalia on Jesus' torso as he hangs on the cross:
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A Few Pictures of the BIGALLO Crucifix
http://www.artic.edu/aic/collections/eurptg/highlight_item?acc=1936.120&page=1
http://80.65.232.176/Photos/00/00/09/34/ME0000093458_3.JPG
A different one that looks similar: http://www.mnstate.edu/gracyk/images/crucifix.jpg
Not many pics online of the BIGALLO, but no more are really needed because these are quite clear.
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Mike Calace explains in the "Rape of the Soul" DVD that embedded images are rated from 1-10, depending on how "evident" the artist WANTED them to be. I'm not an artist so cannot explain it in professional terms, but he explains it well in the DVD.
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Point is: If there are embedded images in RCC artwork, why can't there be the same in WT art?
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Lastly, in my internet searches the other day I ended up at a Catholic FORUM and though 99% of them never saw the DVD, they had the same "I refuse to believe it" attitude as many JWs/exJWs are prone to have, which I thought was quite funny.
Their reasoning went like this:
1. They can't believe the Pope and others "high up" in THEIR Church would not have NOTICED these images BY NOW and DONE SOMETHING ABOUT IT.
2. So: because these Catholics cannot BELIEVE their "religious leaders" could possibly let something like this continue IF IT REALLY EXISTED, then they deduce it CANNOT possibly exist in the FIRST place, and,
3. Therefore, the evidence shown in the Rape of the Soul DVD cannot possibly be true!
How's that for some Blind-Leading-the-Blind reasoning?
I thought it was hysterical -- "We are SO trusting in our LEADERS... they would NEVER let anything like THIS go on unchecked! Therefore, it CANNOT BE TRUE."
Same exact reasoning the "we refuse to believe it" crowd of JWs/exJWs have.
(I can understand why JWs would not believe it, as they are still "IN" and totally blind. But why exJWs still stick up for the WT and refuse to believe that org can be infiltrated by the occult is a "mystery").
/ag
"Watchtower" is a term from witchcraft NOT Scripture
by FuzzyPaul 86 Replies latest watchtower scandals
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abbagail
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abbagail
"Occult Blind" - definition:
This device is known as an ‘occult blind,’ that is, it is designed to “carry an open symbolism acceptable to the uninitiated, yet at the same time, to hide a more profound meaning accessible only to those familiar with Arcane symbolism.” (Ovason, David. THE SECRET ARCHITECTURE OF OUR NATION'S CAPITOL: THE MASONS AND THE BUILDING OF WASHINGTON, D.C., HarperCollins Publishers, 1999; p. 218)
http://watch.pair.com/mystery-babylon-4.html#vaticano
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"Open Mystery" vs. "Occult Blind":
http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:FW7A5qbmJjAJ:www.watch.pair.com/scorpio.html
+Ovason+%22occult+blind%22&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=7&gl=us -
abbagail
MANJANA wrote on page 1 or 2 of this thread:
"By the way, I can tell you that in the invitation to the memorial, there are at least 4 hidden pictures in it."
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Very good. So, Manjana, please do tell us more. Did anybody post this tract at the forum yet? And what are the four embeds? In lieu of an actual picture, just describe them, pretty please! ;-)
Have you seen the 2007 DC tract, "Follow The Christ" which IS posted at the forum: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/131598/1.ashx
See anything in that one?
And btw, welcome. Your ID says you are a "newbie."
/ag -
greendawn
BR25 some Christian celebrations do have pagan origins but they do not in any way seek to promote a pagan deity or practice and that is the difference between Christianity and occultic organisations. If for example they use the symbol of the Egyptian God Ra they use it in a way that is supposed to invoke its demonic powers. But in Christianity who the hell knows or cares about Saturn and that Christmas was set on his date (saturnalia)?
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Manjana
Hi
And thank you for your welcoming
The pictures on the invitation to the memorial. There are 3 at the front. There are the well knowing picture of Jesus riding into Jerusalem. Where the woman are standing with a blanket in front. It looks like there are a chest downunder the blanket. Then on Jesus's hand, there are a sign in his veins.
And then a very difficult picture to see, if you turn the invitation upside down, his mouth is a sleight open, (which it's no, when you look at it normal), you can just see a litle white, the teeth, and a litle red, like the tounge, the 2 naked spots where there are no beard, looks like the eyes, and the rest of the beard around the mouth is the hair. It looks like the face of a warewulf. And I think, it gives some thougts, considering that the memorial day, are celebrated on a full moon evening.
The 4 and last picture I found, are on the back on the invitation. On the sleeve on Jesus's clothes there are a very clear picture, on a face, looking like a mask.
I'm sorry, that I could,nt scann it, I do not have a scanner.
No I have not seen the tract you are asking about, which is posted here, but I will, and tell you if I find anything.
Manjana
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LittleToe
MS:Firstly, I'm not disputing that some higher ranking Masons use the symbol. However... the Masonic version of the crown and cross is most usually placed within a Maltese cross. Does Russell use this? Further, why wouldn't he also use the more common square and compass symbol, if he had Masonic connections? I've never seen this used by Russell or the Watchtower.
I don't know if you'll bother glancing at the following links, but hopefully they will be edifying:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross_and_Crown
http://cemeteries.wordpress.com/2006/09/01/cross-and-crown/
http://www.rootsweb.com/~srgp/flaghold/flag056.htm
And an excerpt:
Many fraternal organization, having "Knights" use the cross in the crown symbol.
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morning glory
Lt,
The last link http://www.rootsweb.com/~srgp/flaghold/flag056.htm
you posted shows a picture of the crown and cross as incorporated into the Knights of the Golden Eagle organization. The crown and cross symbol used by this organization does not resemble Russell's choice for his Watchtower.I don't know if you were inferring that this link was providing a picture of a Masonic Knights Templar symbol,but in any case,it is not;and this is also acknowledged on that link itself.
As the following link further verifies,the crown and cross symbol of the Knights of the Golden Eagle is upright,while the crown and cross symbol of the Masonic Knights Templar of York Rite is on an angle. It is this latter crown and cross symbol that the early Watchtowers resemble.
http://users.erols.com/kgeeaglemiller/knightsofthegoldeneagle.home.html
Regarding the 2nd link http://cemeteries.wordpress.com/2006/09/01/cross-and-crown/
that you posted of the Knights Templar crown and cross as found in cemeteries, we note again that this true representation of a Masonic KT cross ison an angle within the crown.
Incidentally,you said in your post,"Firstly, I'm not disputing that some higher ranking Masons use the symbol.
However... the Masonic version of the crown and cross is most usually placed within a Maltese cross. Does Russell use this?"
However, this same link says the following,
"The Knights Templar version of this symbol is sometimes set within a Maltese cross. Or you will find it near other Masonic symbols..."
I really appreciated your first link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross_and_Crown
showing the Bible Student's crown and cross,as it appears on their original banner and also on the cover of the early Watchtowers.The bay laural wreath that surrounds this cross and crown comes through so clearly in this picture!.You know,somewhere in the back of my mind,I know I've seen that same wreath on the logo of some other organization,but I just can't recall which one it is!
Morning Glory
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LittleToe
The United Nations also use a laurel Wreath.
The Crown with a Cross at an angle, like that, is also used by other Christian organisations that have no Masonic connection. This is my whole point. The symbol is not exclusively Masonic. E.g. (in the top hits from google of "church cross crown"):
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daystar
LT
That has been my point all along as well. But it seems inconceivable, apparently, to some.
