reasoning

by BR25 29 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  jgnat

  Not DF'd here, never joined.

  Is disfellowshipping a superior form of correction? I think of the example of an addict. It is certainly counterproductive to the addict's recovery to be cut off from his entire social network. I would NEVER turn in a JW addict to the judicial process.

  Do some congregation members deliberately sabotage their status as a way to exit? I'd think these people had exited mentally some time ago. I'm thinking of the examples I've heard here of spouses who will commit adultery in order to "release" their partner to remarry.

  Are disaffected members allowed to walk away? I think the annual shepherding visits are case in point that there is no quiet exit allowed. A member under scrutiny MUST state if they believe the Faithful and Discreet Slave. What is the point of a JC six years after a member has left? What possible positive outcome can there be from such action?

  Being the social creatures we are, the disfellowshipped need a social outlet somewhere. Case in point members like Mad or Fred Hathaway, who are "true believers" AND social outcasts. They come here to have SOMEONE to talk to. We can't help it, this is the way human beings are built.

  In the scenario you provided, BR25, a "true believing" disfellowshipped would likely NOT post here. They would either remain alone in their misery, or be busy working on reinstatement.
• 

  new boy

  After 52 years being a Jehovah's Witness.........one day I just woked up and lefted.
• 

  zeroday

  After 52 years being a Jehovah's Witness.........one day I just woked up and lefted.

  I guess i was lucky, it only took me 28 years...
• 

  Frequent_Fader_Miles

  whereas if you just left the congregation and was not disfellowshipped you might not even care to come on here.

  I would disagree with your above statement. I'm not, or never was disfellowshipped. Coming on this site made me so much more aware of how many others have doubts like myself. It it interesting to also note that there are many JWs "in good standing" who are members on this website.
• 

  Quandry

  I think that many who were disfellowshipped were treated so badly by the men in charge-the "Spiritual Shepherds" that they began to question their involvement with the WTS. By very virtue of the name, we conjure up a picture of a shepherd wanting to herd the sheep that has gone astray back to the fold; to protect it; to nurture it; to restore it to health.

  Granted, some people do evil things, such as child abuse, and potential victims should be warned against these people, and maybe there would be no way to restore such a person to health. In these cases, however, we generally find that the WTS wanted to protect their image, and disfellowshipped people who might warn others against the abuser, while stating that unless there were two witnesses to the abuse, they would take no action in the congregation.

  But, I think that those who manifest a problem drinking, or begin to smoke, or date a wordly person, should be offered help. Sometimes, yes, this would involve long term investments of time. Instead, many are humiliated, berated, and abused. Elders ask unbelievably unnecessarily personal questions in the case of sexual misconduct.

  Sometimes, even very young people are treated in a cruel manner. That is what happened to my family. My teen daughter did some common stupid teen stuff-nothing as bad as I did as a teen. Instead, men chose to accuse her for over two and one half hours of fornication, after stating that there was no accusation of such, admission, or witnesses. When she would not admit to this, they told her they were not going to believe her. They made her read a scripture that God viewed her as filth, and she would burn in the fire with the devil and his angels. They humiliated and berated her. Then they disfellowshipped her without an explanation as to why.

  Try going into your senior year of High School having not one friend in the world. No one to talk to. No friend for support. Being told by men that you consider the highest authority on earth-those having God's spirit- that God considers you nothing, and neither do they.

  In short, until my family was personally treated in this horrific way, I felt more or less as you do. Until it affected me personally, and I could see for myself the destruction to people's lives and family that disfellowhipping brings, I am sorry to say that I felt it was completely fairly administered and always justified. Reading many stories here, and certainly having my own family almost destroyed, was a devastating eye-opener.

  Maybe if you continue reading more posts...........

  It was at this point that I went to the internet, typed in Jehovah's Witnesses and Abuse, and the floodgates opened.
• 

  jelcat8224

  To be disfellowshipped most of the time it is for something that even a non jw would not think is right, but I feel that some come on here for an outlet or try to find some relief of being disfellowshipped, whereas if you just left the congregation and was not disfellowshipped you might not even care to come on here. ... Most of you dont know what is said on here, what scriptures or info is on here, but when you find out, your posts turn into I am glad I am out, I always knew that it was a false religion, and so forth. This is total BS in my opinion, most of you probably dont know or think these things till you come on here, and some of you would never come on here if you did nothing wrong and you know it.

  Ummm ... I'm sorry but you CLEARLY have no idea what you are talking about. I am not DF, or DA, ... yet! I have not done anything worthy of being DF'd other than ask direct questions which have fallen on deaf ears. This site was the LAST stop for me in my journey out of this organization. So for you to say we had no knowlegde of the info on this site till we came here is just ABSURD!!! And I have yet to read anyone on here say that they ALWAYS KNEW IT WAS A FALSE RELIGION, although there may be some who feel this way! For most of us who were in it, comming to this realization was a process. For some, this process is on-going.

  I think your generalization is BS!
• 

  golf2

  Zeroday, I had been an elder before. The interesting part of this story is, I grew up with one of these elders, interesting isn't it? I'm glad it happened, I got to see their true colors. One of the interesting things about golf is, you move on !!!!!!
  
  Golf
• 

  flipper

  BR25, I have never been a JW. I came on here after seeing a LOT of insane behavior by good standing JW's. Hatred, you say? What you see on this board is a drop in the bucket compared to what is regularly practised in that church. Good grief. One of my first observations was that most of the kind, strong and honest people leave. And that an awful lot of "good standing" JW's have this funny habit - the pot is always calling the kettle black. Hint, hint..... flipper
• 

  RollerDave

  I used to see those folks who picket conventions and hear that they had a problem with disfellowshipping, but being young and smug I just thought to myself, "well, if they don't want to do the things a witness does and want to do the things a witness does not do, what do they expect?"

  The mindset from within can be so pervasively naive.

  I really believed that the brothers were higly qualified and trained, that the justice of the system was beyond question, that DF'ing was never done on the basis of something trivial!

  The idea that someone could disagree with the 'truth' is just so unthinkable to those submerged in the Kool-Ade that whenever someone leaves the rumors fly fast and furious about the sex, drugs and rock n' roll the departed left the "truth" for.

  From this environment steeped in smug certaintly and niaive ignorance comes young BR to enlighten us and lay bare our wrondoing in such an eloquent manner that we are all sure to repent and throw ourselves on the dubious mercy of the nearest congregation!

  He doesn't seem like a bad sort for an eighth-grader, so lets go easy on him and see where it leads. At worst he can annoy us, but at best it may provide some amusement or turn up a point that hasn't yet been made.

  So, what say you BR?

  Awaiting enlightenment,

  Roller
• 

  beginnersmind

  I do think you make an interesting point although i wouldnt have put it quite like that if i was writing it. I think your post has been slated slightly unfairly as you do say "some who have been disfellowshipped".

  My point is most people dont just wake up the next day after being disfellowshipped and automatically stop believing in the jw faith, but then they come on here and try to make it ok, and everyone makes it ok for them which is alright. You can do what you want, but I think alot of disfellowshipped ones come on here to grant themselves some kind of immunity. Like I said before you just dont wake up the next day and stop believing.

  However when you make the point above you say "a lot of disfellowshipped ones come on here......." and that doesnt help your cause against generalisation. So while i dont agree with the way youve written it you may be right in what youve said about some. However they are not likely to come on your thread and agree are they?

  About this post

  How about if a JW husband (rank and file) commits adultry and is disfellowshipped and an Elder commits adultry and is not disfellwshipped.

  Or an Elders daughter gets pregant out of wedlock and is not disfellowshipped and a daughter of a R&F gets pregant and is disfellowshipped.

  Or an Elders son is caught in a homosexual act and is not disfellowshipped and a R&F's son is and is disfellowshipped...

  How right ZeroDay is; each one of these events has occured in my wifes congregation, makes me sick!

  So in that congregation all 6 circumstances have happened? So not only do you know the reasons why the 3 rank and file were disfellowshipped you also know that the exact same things were commited by an elder or his son or daughter even though they werent disfellowshipped? Does everybody know everybody elses business in that cong? Must be gossip central. In the cong i was associated with i would say disfellowshippings were an even split between the rank and file and elder/families if not more on the latter. As there were considerably more rank and file than elders/families it meant if you were an elder or a family member you were more likely to be disfellowshipped than a rank and file right? Or is my maths wrong?