Isn't God Awesome? (page 5)

J-ex-W

Haven't watched the video yet, though I'm about to...I won't pick on it or you, Perry! J-ex-W

Perry, I have told you before that I have -- with acute awareness -- seen within this body and mind the ability to commit the most vile of atrocities. it happened because radical honesty and openness is a requisite of authentic inner investigation, which I feel is important in coming to know what is true, and what is not; and chances are good that if you had breasts, a vagina and a nice curvy ass I'd be lusting after you as well. So what! We're not talking about me, we were discussing the sense of awe at such a wondrous and vast expression of life and nature, and whether we are motivated to attribute such beauty to something finite and small....such as an anthropomorphic deity, or something more.

The basic difference between our approach is that my sense of what the word G-O-D points to is unconditionally without beginning and end. It is what all existence: universes, things and gods exist within. On the other hand you and many others seem to tenaciously champion one of these little gods. You are free to do that. Just don't think i'm a fool for not.

j

An extraordinary claim, but you do provide some extraordinary evidence...

Who are you?

The basic difference between our approach is that my sense of what the word G-O-D points to is unconditionally without beginning and end. It is what all existence: universes, things and gods exist within. On the other hand you and many others seem to tenaciously champion one of these little gods. You are free to do that. Just don't think i'm a fool for not.

Now this is definately Awesome! The my God is bigger than yours answer! Pretty tough to find fault with, and you have to admit, delivered quite nicely!!!

Perry

Startingover writes:

So I guess you are saying that no matter what, if I'm not chosen like you it makes no difference what I do.

To the contrary. What you do determines your eternal destiny. Why do you believe you are not chosen? Did an enemy tell you this? Certainly no sin is big enough that God cannot forgive.... otherwise Christ died for nothing. Jesus said that he'd give a full pardon to whosoever would ask him in faith. Of course if a person believes that he has no sin then he would naturally find that illogical and "bemeath him" and would never "keep on asking".

What am I supposed to do in this horrible state of sin I live in since I wasn't chosen?

Again, were you deceived into believing that you were not chosen? You keep repeating this and it sounds exactly like the WT indoctrination to me. You cannot present any evidence to prove you were not chosen. It aint over till its over bubba.

Some Christians believe that most if not all will be chosen, it's just a matter of time. I believe that "many are called, few are chosen". But, compared to what? 200 million is few compared to 10 Billion. So is 2 Billion, so is 3 Million.

Why even bother saying it if there's no hope? Are you just rubbing it in?

: "Come to Me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest.

Not only is there hope, there is guarantee by the Source himself. It doesn't stop there. We are living in a time of absolutely no judgement with the promise of being ten times more glorified than angels.... spirit, soul and body! We will even be their judge in heaven.

We must ask for the pardon though. It seems so simple, and it is....although costly. That is why the enemy must convince people that they are already condemmed, that there is no hope, and that they have no sin (to speak of), because the reality is that great hope and salvation is in the world and it does not condemn them, it frees them. The enemy fears the elect!

Jesus said:

John 14:4-11

6 Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

This is the very hope that was denied all of us as Jehovah's Witnesses. I personally try to point that out every chance I get. For me, the choice was deny Christ or say goodbye to ALL my family. I chose Christ and my family were true to their word. Alone in the world, God gave me a wife and two beautiful children so far. We're working together now that we are friends and nothing separates us.

One more word on the cost:

"Or suppose a king is about to go to war against another king. Will he not first sit down and consider whether he is able with ten thousand men to oppose the one coming against him with twenty thousand? 32 If he is not able, he will send a delegation while the other is still a long way off and will ask for terms of peace.33 In the same way, any of you who does not give up everything he has cannot be my disciple.

Jesus is that far off King with more troops than we have. He has stated his terms of peace .... ALL OF IT. You must surrender all your sin. It then becomes his problem, not yours.

The price of freedom is high... the reward is great. Don't start unless you intend to allow Him to finish the job within you.

Perry

So what! We're not talking about me, we were discussing the sense of awe at such a wondrous and vast expression of life and nature, and whether we are motivated to attribute such beauty to something finite and small....such as an anthropomorphic deity, or something more.

But, I was talking about you and the problem of sin that the god you describe does not address. It leads me to believe that either he does not care about justice or he does not care about you and me. This subject is simply ignored in your view of god. I belive it to be very dangerous to ignore this.

That the Word was made weak and became flesh for me is quite astonishing, even if it's not very fancy or eloquent to imagine.

Here's a rendition of my God.... salvation to me, a stumbling block to others:

http://www.christcrucified.com/christcrucified.html

greendawn

The point is that so much beauty is more likely the work of an intelligent creator rather than blind chance, what's the point of going so much beyond what is necessary for the mere survival of the various life forms? Philosophically it doesn't stand. Why the intelligence, the delicious food, the sense of and delight in music, the unique face and voice of each human etc

And aren't the evolutionists also parroting their adapted theory for which there is no conclusive proof?

JamesThomas

Perry:

I was talking about you and the problem of sin that the god you describe does not address. It leads me to believe that either he does not care about justice or he does not care about you and me. ThiBut,s subject is simply ignored in your view of god. I belive it to be very dangerous to ignore this.

Yes, I understand how you are viewing this and how it seems I am ignoring the dichotomy of "evil".

Though the mind which dwells in dualities can not comprehend it, there is That which exists before all definable differences, as pure non-duality and complete perfection and wholeness.

It is the foundational Reality of all existence, and as such can be realized as our own true Self when there is a thorough investigation in and through all senses of duality and fragmentation.

It can not be captured in a religion or belief system, or in a personal god. It's too big. Too immediate. Too all encompassing. It is what we all are just beneath all the fragmented thingness we believe ourselves and others to be. We are the very perfection and wholeness we seek. It requires sincere and earnest, ruthlessly honest and open investigation into our most intimate and vibrant senses of being and existing. It requires a looking past everything ever believed to be. ...(especially our "sinfulness").

The greatest journey ever, is to here.....where you are already.

j

LtCmd.Lore

How about a subject renewal:

Looking at all the beautiful stuff.

Do you think that god made beautiful stuff, and then made humans who enjoy it?

Or do you think that god made stuff, and then made humans in such a way that they percieve this stuff as beautiful?

Basically, is pretty stuff pretty by it's nature, or is it just a mental thing to humans? Did god design the universe for humans, or humans for the universe?

Lore

nvrgnbk

Yes I am!

Thanks for the props, Perry my boy.

Perry

[My god] is the foundational Reality of all existence, and as such can be realized as our own true Self when there is a thorough investigation in and through all senses of duality and fragmentation.

I'm sorry JamesT, this doesn't fly with me. If your God can be realized as your own true self then who pays for your sin? You? A person could easily decide not to punish himself but then to punish others for the same crimes. What does the absence of, or lopsided nature of that kind of punishment do to 'justice"?

That is as bad as Flying High Now 's concept of a God that simply blew himself up in order to create us. She is more comfortable with a God like that. Sort of a Suicide Bomber God. The children of a god like that "~~grow~~ blow up so fast these days ya know"

Isn't God Awesome?

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