Was man created perfect? (page 2)

moshe

Good point, Narkissos. Some say that two stories were merged together from the two separate scrolls of the North and South Kingdoms.

Deputy Dog

as defective and in misery

Wow! This random universe treating you bad?

brinjen

How do you define perfect? On whose perception is this based upon? Found a good link here

http://www.christianworldchurch.co.uk/page8.htm

A bit deep for me at this time of the morning, I need a coffee, I'll be back soon

Deputy Dog

moshe

JW's have developed the dogma that they will live forever as humans on a paradise earth cleansed of all wicked men

Good point!

When do they have their own (individual) wickedness cleansed?

zack

Though I do not agree with everything said, I never fully accepted the whole Garden of Eden story as purely a historical recounting. Even as a child growing up as a JW,

I felt that Adam and Eve should get another chance to get it right. We were always told that humans make mistakes and what we do with the knowledge of those mistakes

is what determines our character, whether good or bad. Adam and Eve never had that chance. They weren't allowed a mistake. They had to get it right the first time and facing forces

which were smarter and more powerful than they were. They had no frame of reference, only a direct command (according to the story.) They were in many respects like children.

The more you look at it the more it looks like they were almost destined to fail, or maybe succeed depending on how you look at it.

As for the concept of perfection, that's something I never found in the Bible. Sin and sinlessness, perhaps--- but not perfection.

Maybe God got what he wanted after all---- beings who struggle, grope, even in the dark for something better, something more---- maybe it's the struggle that makes us beautiful to God.

Children who make lemonades from lemons, who do the best they can, and who love deeply and with fire even in the face of death.

I know that I would rather struggle and learn then be some lobotomized replica of the "perfect" man.

The notion of Adam and Eve being "perfect" is not something stated in Genesis or even the rest of the Bible. The idea seems to have been given impetus by St. Augustine and was adopted by many commentators in the 19th century, especially those who C. T. Russell borrowed many ideas from. It's a derived notion, then, and it creates all sorts of logical inconsistencies -- even assuming that the two creation stories in Genesis are reconcilable (Narkissos has pointed out the difficulties in doing this in several posts). These logical inconsistencies were, for me, one of the main reasons I began questioning the Watchtower's ideas on Christian doctrine. After a good deal of study, I concluded that the Watchtower view of sin and the ransom sacrifice are complete nonsense. I've brought these things up with a number of JWs over the years, including the Society itself, and not one has been able to reconcile the inconsistencies.

If interested, readers can find my arguments in the article "God's Justice: Sin, Imperfection, and the Ransom Sacrifice" here: http://corior.blogspot.com/2006/02/gods-justice-sin-imperfection-and.html

AlanF

Mum

Only woman was created "perfect."

But, seriously, "perfect" is a subjective term. My idea of the perfect sofa for my living room might differ greatly from the idea of my designer (as if I have a designer).

My question is, When did the animals, non-human creatures, fall from grace, into illness and death? What did they do wrong?
Maybe that's another thread.

Regards,

SandraC

moshe

Thanks for the article, Alan. I read it and it is apparent just how weak the WT scholarship is in it's theology. Someone once told me that WT books are written on a 6th grade level of comprehension. Maybe this is due more to the native intelliegence of the writing department at Bethel than by design.

OUTLAW

..If you were perfect,on this planet.You would be a God!!..Was Man created as a God???..So much Bullshit...OUTLAW

crazyblondeb

Was Man created as a God???..So much Bullshit...OUTLAW

At the risk of repeating myself........That's why when God created man, She was only joking!!!!!!!

Was man created perfect?

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