DO THE MEMBERS OF THE GB BELIEVE THEIR OWN PROPAGANDA?

by nvrgnbk 45 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Finally-Free

  DO THE MEMBERS OF THE GB BELIEVE THEIR OWN PROPAGANDA?

  This question reminded me of a friend I had before I was a JW. He was an incredible liar. Beginning when we were teenagers, he started telling a number of fantastic stories to women about our alleged exploits, so they would be impressed and hopefully, he'd get laid. Naturally, all these stories were either lies or grossly exaggerated, and most of them included me. At first I protested, but I eventually gave up when I discovered his tactic was working, and we were getting laid a lot. After about 5 years of this he gave me a serious look one day, and asked me if some of our "exploits" really happened that way. I thought about it and honestly could no longer remember what was true and what wasn't. We had been repeating our lies so many times for so many years that we no longer knew truth from fiction.

  I suspect that could be the case with some JWs. Some know it's a crock of shit, and some believe it because of the repitition.

  W
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  nvrgnbk

  We had been repeating our lies so many times for so many years that we no longer knew truth from fiction.

  I suspect that could be the case with some JWs. Some know it's a crock of shit, and some believe it because of the repitition.

  W

  That makes alot of sense Finally-Free!

  You just earned yourself a Sunday brunch!
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  done4good

  Nvr, my take on the subject is this:

  Probably the most convincing aspect of "the Lie", to most dubs, is that there really is a "top down" belief in the rhetoric they teach. In other words, a person who truly believes in what they preach is a very good salesman, no matter how wacked out thier explanations may be. Hence, I would say that as a group, they believe. (Can't get red to turn off, damn, the idosyncracies of this website drive me nuts sometimes!!). As individuals, they can and do disagree with what the org. officially teaches. This, unfortunately, is built in to their system. They are allowed to do that, so they see nothing wrong with it, and can remain true believers as a group.

  I knew Dan Sydlik on a personal level somewhat, and he often had his own ideas on things, privately. He also saw nothing wrong with telling others these things. The trouble is, as a group, they believe in the "group think" concept, more than anything else.

  Jason
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  eclipse

  Just like the moon can appear to block out the sun, Their lies can block out the truth....and they believe their own lies, since they have been propagating them for 90 years now. Soon though, that house of cards will crumble, and they will have to eat their lies.

  -e
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  nvrgnbk

  Soon though, that house of cards will crumble, and they will have to eat their lies.

  Can't wait!
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  choosing life

  I think most of them at the top believe they are God's chosen ones. Whether they believe every little doctrine does not matter, because they change doctrines easily.

  I am sure that the driving force is self-preservation, for themselves and what they think is God's organization. They are driven by what they call "theocratic warfare". Using this teaching, they can justify just about anything in their minds, as long as it preserves "God's organization".

  There may be a few who know better. The others have learned to stuff away any doubts that come to the surface. I have only met 2 members of the governing body and they were both quite nice at the time. It is hard to know what truly drives a person.
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  nvrgnbk

  It is hard to know what truly drives a person.

  So very true.
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  Narkissos

  One thing I most enjoyed in Crisis of Conscience is the nuanced portrait of several GB members, especially Ray's uncle Freddy, as both sincere and cynical.

  After I left I have often wondered about that myself. When I was a JW I could have sworn I was sincere, but looking back I can remember many times when I felt unsatisfied with the arguments I was using -- however, in a constant "take or leave" situation, as long as you don't really see leaving as an option, you just make the best with the whole package -- victim of a system and guilty of perpetuating it at the same time.

  The question of sincerity, imo, rarely calls for a "yes" or "no" answer; rather, perhaps a quantitative one: how much. And how sincere you allow yourself to be at a given moment depends on so many factors, emotional in particular. Relationships are critical, too. When you spend all your time among fellow believers who expect you to upbuild and confirm their faith and commitment it takes a serious personal crisis to even start questioning the whole structure on your own.
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  B_Deserter

  They at least fool themselves into believing what they teach. I think when organizational arrangements and doctrines are changed, they probably honestly believe its God's Will and part of the "New Light." In reality, these "convenient" changes are subconscious. They *want* to change a doctrine because it will avoid lawsuits, and lo and behold, God agrees!
  
  I also think they must read "apostate" arguments and criticism (even though they forbid "common" witnesses from doing so). The Society isn't forthcoming about its history and wrong predictions? Enter the Proclaimers Book in 1993, which provides enough information for the average witness to simultaneously be proud of the "progress" made as the "light gets brighter," and have a new mental opiate to help roll their eyes and dismiss any criticism of the society. I know this for a fact, because I did it when my disfellowshipped brother tried to talk to us about doctrinal changes. I shrugged my shoulders and said, "yeah, I knew all that, it was wrong, and we no longer believe it. The information is right there in the Proclaimers Book, so what's your point?" Funny how the Proclaimers book doesn't mention that even though doctrines like the cross and birthdays/holidays were found to be in error in 1917, they weren't done away with until many years AFTER they received God's Holy Spirit, which was withdrawn earlier than 1917 because they were doing the same thing they were doing afterwards.
  
  Does that mean that simply acknowledging something is wrong is enough to get God's spirit, even if you continue to observe the practice?
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  candidlynuts

  I also think they must read "apostate" arguments and criticism (even though they forbid "common" witnesses from doing so

  i dont think the governing body reads it. arent all but 2 of them pretty dang old?

  more and more their power is being stripped away, if anyone reads apostate arguments its the ones in power, the legal and service commitee honchos. they may fill the GB in on what they want them to know. but the gb itself, doesnt seem hold much power anymore.