Universalism

choosing life

I was talking to a friend who believes that everyone will acieve eternal life eventually. She used some scriptures that make sense to me.

1 Cor. 15:22 -For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ, all will be made alive.

Rom.8 :38,39- Basically states that nothing can seperate us from God's love.

It was kind of refreshing to hear her talk about everyone being important and worthwhile to God. It is so different from the petty, mean-spirited God that the jws seem to proclaim who wants to destroy most of mankind.

What do you think? Is eveyone important to God?

Carmel

That concept is confirmed in the Baha'i scriptures. carmel

gaiagirl

This is one of the priciples in Unitarian-Universalism, that no one person or group is favored over others in the sight of the divine.

Qcmbr

Just out of interest then Carmel is that tantamount to saying it doesn't matter what you do? IS Hitler invited to your heaven?

Doug Mason

I strongly recommend you read "Life in the Son" by Robert Shank ISBN 1-55661-091-2.

I recently started a thread on "Etenal Life", in which I put the basic tenet that etenal life resides in Jesus Christ. This means that as long as the believer in Jesus remains a believer, then eternal life resides in the believer (such as 1 John 5:10-12).

But it is possible for a believer to fall away and thus become separated from the source of eternal life. Hitler might have had Eternal Life at some stage as a Christian but lost it as a tyrant. A believer might fellowship with Jesus, and it is possible for that believer to be disfellowshipped by becoming a disbeliever.

The term "Eternal Life" is not to be understood in terms of its duration but in terms of its source and its quality. My mother is 96 years old and getting quite frail in mind and body. If her life were simply stretched out for another 100 years, I wonder what condition she would be in. Is that what we want from Eternal Life?

Doug

PrimateDave

Okay, just for the sake of argument, I'm going to say that no one believes in Universalism. If god could fix everything bad that ever happened, who would care what Hitler and the Third Reich ever did? Deep down we know better than that.

Furthermore, Christians do not believe in eternal life in heaven or on earth. Why? Because murder is always punished and genocide is considered an unfathomable crime against humanity. Deep down we know that a murder victim just doesn't exist anymore, and we want "justice."

If you knew for a certainty that you would go to heaven and "be with god" when you die, why not thank murderers for getting you there sooner. Old age would be a crime, indeed!

Suicide could be more socially acceptable, and Kevorkian wouldn't have gone to prison.

But, no, everyone fears death because deep down they know that the here-and-now is all we ever get. This life is all there is, and everyone already knows it.

Dave

gumby

ChoosingLife.....it's been a learning experience for the many of us who have already walked down the path you are now on in your search for truth (spiritual).

We see church joining, book reading, class taking people that leave the dubs to find spiritual truth and refreshment to come to the part in the road that says " nobody REALLY knows what life is all about, but if you can't take that for an answer and be content, then keep traveling". Your next stop will probably be at the place in the road called" the bible can't be believed".

You know full well the bible speaks of those who will not attain salvation because of remaining sinners and not living a christlike life nor even believing in the giver of life. The bible has so many warnings for the faithful not to slip back into their old ways and lose their life by being thrown in with the old snake and his buddies to eternal damnation. Even Jesus didn't believe he'd spare all.

So, your gonna find a christian church that goes along with you in what you yourself believes is "truth", or your gonna find that you can't put stock in any of the churches because there is conflict in the bible to begin with, hence you'll question the bible itself and start down another road. My guess is it will be the latter. Don't forget to rest now and then.

Gumby

greendawn

The JWs may be at one extreme but universalism goes to the other. Biblically there will be a portion of the angels and mankind that will suffer the second death from which there is no salvation, that's what the book of Revelation states.

At the end of the day man and angel have the option to choose what they want, life or death. For the angels that fell their fate has been decided since they remain unrepentant and go from bad to worse. Humans are not so clear cut they are imperfect and issues of ignorance and coercion come into play. Even so some committed serious crimes without these mitigating circumstances (ignorance/coercion) being valid in their case. I can't see how their slate will be wiped clean as long as they remain unrepentant.

Narkissos

I came out of JWs a convinced universalist -- not for scriptural reasons, as some scriptures do point to that direction but many others definitely don't. Just because I felt that a "redemption" which would leave out anyone or anything would not be up to its name.

Later I came to think that no "happy ending," whether for some or for all, would suit the play either.

Mum

Ambrose Bierce's definition of Universalist went something like this: One who is willing to forego the benefits of eternal fire and damnation for his neighbors.

His book, The Devil's Dictionary, is online. It's hilarious!

Regards,

SandraC

Universalism

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