Spiritual Self-Assessment (page 3)

nvrgnbk

Before I was born: WHERE WAS I?

First in yo Daddy.

Then in yo Momma.

JamesThomas

Terry:

Before I was born: WHERE WAS I? Who was I?

Now we're getting somewhere.

What is this "I" that does or does not do "spiritual" things? Right here, right now, who/what am I?

Is there to be found an "I", beyond the mind's definitions? Is what is aware of the mind's imagery and characterizations really and truly any of these things?

What the hell am I, really?

j

purplesofa

Thanks again for a nice thread!

I feel good

Hi everyone!

purps

alt thanks for helping me come to a peaceful place in my life!!!

Terry

Terry:
Before I was born: WHERE WAS I? Who was I?
Now we're getting somewhere.
What is this "I" that does or does not do "spiritual" things? Right here, right now, who/what am I?
Is there to be found an "I", beyond the mind's definitions? Is what is aware of the mind's imagery and characterizations really and truly any of these things?
What the hell am I, really?
j

My experience with my own existence has consisted of:

1.Awareness without lexicon or context; a swarm of sensations followed by...

2.Analysis of perceptions focused onto causes and effects

3.Contact with others guiding a language into channels of speech/response

4.Development of identity, personality and history

5.Ego and determinism

In other words, if I was ever a spirit (without a meat body) there is no awareness, no consciousness and no history of being.

So, how can we simply assert into being that which is not a part of our awareness?

We can be TOLD and persuaded we existed, etc. But, that coaxing and cajoling isn't really our own identification of self.

Without this meat husk the assemblage of neurons, synapses and nerve endings is about as focused and identifiable as an old car battery.

How/why assert into being a SPIRIT?

First, I have never asserted that we are a "spirit". The questions you quoted me as asking are not attempts at selling anyone on being a "spirit", or presented to help people determine they are a "spirit". I'm not sure what the hell a "spirit" is, and I don't much care. So, we may be talking apples and oranges here, and this probably can't help but confuse further comment, but I'll go ahead anyway. Fool that I am.

My experience with my own existence has consisted of:
1.Awareness without lexicon or context; a swarm of sensations followed by...
2.Analysis of perceptions focused onto causes and effects
3.Contact with others guiding a language into channels of speech/response
4.Development of identity, personality and history
5.Ego and determinism

Notice that all that followed that which I highlighted in yellow, is contingent upon it (Awareness). All these things are mental constructs happening where? Within awareness. Awareness gives them existence. Awareness gives dreams existence to.

In other words, if I was ever a spirit (without a meat body) there is no awareness, no consciousness and no history of being.
So, how can we simply assert into being that which is not a part of our awareness?
How/why assert into being a SPIRIT?

As an individual we can only assume: if there is no body, there is no awareness. Like we can not know what's in the next county until we go there, we can not be certain until the body is gone or until Conscious-awareness itself somehow informs us before then, whether or not conscious-awareness is totally dependant upon the body.

As far as "assert into being", it seems it is possible for many to assert into being that existence extends only as far and as long as the body exists, how can we do this and why? Personally, I don't want to assert anything here, but rather desire to see first hand what is or is not true.

We can be TOLD and persuaded we existed, etc. But, that coaxing and cajoling isn't really our own identification of self.

I agree completely.

To be totally honest all we know with absolute certainty about our existence, is what you stated first, there is "awareness". Everything after that, everything that awareness is aware of, may be a dream or thoughts and circumstance mistakenly incorporated into a "me".

So the point is to not be cajoled into any "identification of self". Lets work with what we genuinely have. Lets investigate sincerely, thoroughly and severely into the one and only reality we have: conscious-awareness. How deep does it go? What am "I" at the core? Does consciousness exist only as far as the body?

I can't say, because that would only be cajoling, and that don't work. Nothing said, thought or believed, works. The only way is via radical and open, nakedly honest, first-hand observation into conscious-awareness. That's why I ask the questions I did. They are not something the mind can authentically answer. We need to go deeper than the mind. Deeper into what sees the mind.

Understandably, this may seem strange or even crazy to question what we have for so long accepted as the beginnings and ends of self and reality. But it may require a radical stepping outside past bounds in order to discover further. Are we right now experiencing the totality of our present being? As far as I can see, there is only one way to find out for certain.

j

poppers

Great post, James - as usual.

JamesThomas

Purps.

Mmmmm, love your picture

I didn't know you were so young.

j

Spiritual Self-Assessment

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