LONG discussion with my parents. (long post of course) (page 3)

LtC: Wish I could hire you to be my debate "wing-man" if the time ever comes. Congratulations on being able to keep your cool when the frustration of the circular logic merry-go-round started to build.

Thanks for taking the time to post in such detail. I need all the "virtual" practice sessions I can get.

Marcel said:

for every question there is a "just-add-water" watchtower response.

LOL. Just when I think I've read them all, a new phrase like that pops up. I like it.

Back to LtC:

I'm sorry you're having to deal with this crap. It's a tragic web that the Tower has woven. Sadly, being extra smart doesn't make the way out any less painful.

We're here for you in cyberspace.

Open Mind

OUTLAW

LT..You are a smart young man..It`s obvious your parents stopped thinking for themselves many years ago...OUTLAW

drew sagan

Lore,

Your 18 and finding your way in the world while at the same time having a family that is stuck in a cult. I think it's important that you realize a very important thing.

You will never be able to prove to your parents anything, period. They are always going to view you as below them, especially when you are living in their home.

JWs don't change their minds because they lost an argument. Some people do, but JWs never will. They have to make the change themselves. They have to come to the point where they come to doubt the WTS. If it is not their own experience they will not change.

I think this simple idea helps a person to understand how to engage JWs. You can be a voice there on the side as that person goes about their own experience or you can be a sounding voice that tries to force your own experience upon them.

For a good period of time I chose the latter and tried to make my struggle with the WTS other JWs struggle. But none of them where me. None of them where looking at life the way I was looking at life so my arguments and ideas meant nothing to them.

My wife on the other hand was having her own experience and I didn't even realize it. I kept looking at the things I thought where so bad about JWs that I didn't even realize that my wife was on her way out. At one point I thought I might be stuck in the WTS for years and was real desperate. This turned out to be a week before she opened up and stated that it probably was all wrong!!!!

We have a limited perspective. You have the opportunity to take this very slow. I would suggest you simply let this on to your parents that you are going through a 'phase' and plan ahead for your future.

Don't think you have to make a big statement to them at this point in your life. It's just not worth it IMO.

Smiles_Smiles

Well good for you to be able to have that discussion. You were able to see your parents a little clearer. See how snowed they really are. It's just a belief but for JW's believe belief is EVERYTHING!

I can imagine that at 18 living with your parents and working for a brother you must feel really stuck. Just remember you have a good head on your shoulders and you have a full life in front of you. You can go to college and have a real job not connected to JW's. Or you can just get out on your own and not go to college. The point is the choice is yours and not your parents or some organization that likes to limit your choices. You may end up loosing your parent's but that choice is up to them.

Just keep your chin up and remember to look forward instead of somehow getting sunk into being consumed with the past and the JW stuff. You got a bright future ahead or you. Try to waste as little time as possible on the whole JW way of life and putting up with them controlling your actions. We already know you have freed your mind!! Go about freeing your body as well.

Get Busy Living Life!!! It can be a BLAST!!!

Hugs,

Smiles

5go

"Yeah, but that's world war II, the first on was the important one."

That's one I hate to agree with the dubs on. WW1 was a more ground shaking war on the grounds of how many century long monarch's collasped over night. There is one problem though it didn't start armageddon. Which according to Russel's original idea it was supposed to do. That also it started way to late in the year and really didn't get going good till 1915.

White Dove

Lore,

That was an awsome discussion on your part! Here are some of my ideas that I use now. Sure wish I had your ammo then:

No where in the Bible are the words "Jehovah's organization" or any other org., for that matter. The Sanhedrin(spell?) was an org of sorts as if you got kicked out of it it would wreck your social life (or is it that they had the power to oust you from society and that wrecked your life?) I'm remembering the blind man's parents. No need to belong to anything.

Don't need to belong to anything as the Ethiopian Eunich went his way and did not see Phillip, again. The Bible made a point of mentioning the permanence of that departure. His baptism was within a few minutes of approaching an "elder" not months or years and no questions required to answer.

Jesus said, "Come to me..." not a man made org.

Prodigal son was instantly welcomed back and it was the rude good brother that shunned him and was written about in a bad light. Shunning is unscriptual as it appears in a bad light in the Bible. Why shun people but not celebrate b-days??? Hmmm...killing makes a person bad, not the date or celebration. So the Pharoah and king were ok but their bdays were bad???

thepackage

LT, keep up the fight. Your awesome to be only 18 and using your brain. Don't get caught up on the WTS BS. It will hurt if your pareent stop talking with you but, al least you'll hvae peace of mind.

Lo-ru-hamah

Lore,

Awesome job. I wish that I had thought about the organization the way you are now.

Might I suggest that the next time your parents refer to the organization being run by imperfect men ask

them "Why is it okay for JW's to be run by imperfect men

and not Catholics, Protestants, Baptists, etc?"

No one has been able to come up with an acceptable answer around here.

Good luck in your pursuit. I hope they decide that you have a right to believe what you will and love you unconditionally.

Loruhamah

Hortensia

"Or, you can just move on with your life, but it is better to leave some smoking wrecks to mark your passage."

That made me laugh, but you have to be careful about burning bridges. I don't mind burning bridges, but I don't have a lot to lose. However, if you want to leave some smoking wreckage to mark your passage, join the military. That would thoroughly make your point that you don't believe, and it would provide an income and living quarters and food - and an education. Join the military to learn something really useful like being a corpsman which can translate to a medical civilian job like a paramedic later on.

LONG discussion with my parents. (long post of course)

Odrade

Open mind