Prayer a Waste of Time?

by WTWizard 39 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  WTWizard

  How often do you hear about prayer at the meeting that, if you should pray that if Jehovah wills that He should do something? To me, this is a total waste of time to pray if that condition applies. You see, if Jehovah willed something, why would He need to wait for you to ask Him for it? Does Jehovah need your permission or request to do anything He damn well pleases? I don't think so.

  Then, what about asking for something that He doesn't will? Is it possible, if Jehovah doesn't want something to happen or someone to get something, that a lousy request is going to change His will? Hardly. Once Jehovah wills against something, no amount of prayer is going to change that. Not even making deals and bargains: Jehovah will continually add more to your load while withholding fulfillment of the request in order to milk it for even more concessions. You don't get the thing you wanted. Jehovah gets extra from you. You have been scammed by the Almighty!

  Basically, if Jehovah wants something to happen, He isn't going to wait for someone to ask before doing it: He is going to just go ahead and do it anyway. If He doesn't want something to happen, you are wasting your time trying to get through and get Him to change; He is only going to either dig in His heels and will it even farther away, or He is going to scam you into giving Him more and more service, milking it by withholding the things hoped for. Either way, praying is a total waste of time.

  Besides, why thank Jehovah for doing what He wanted to do anyway?
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  FlipThis

  no, I talk to myself all the time...

  it's very therapeutical.
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  Gregor

  .. therapeutical..

  I think it is spelled "therapootickle"
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  WTWizard

  There is a difference between talking to oneself (or thinking aloud) and prayer, especially in the Watchtower format. I here define prayer as making a supplication, thanks, or request to God (in this case, Jehovah). Praying to Jehovah that you are pxxxed for Him not answering it, making too many unauthorized switches and taking too many liberties, or taking too damn long to answer it is not the waste of time. What is a waste of time is asking Him for anything or to thank Him, since He is not going to be moved to do anything He hasn't already willed by a supplication, nor is He going to need a supplication to get moving on His will.
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  wherehasmyhairgone

  Gods own words on the matter

  http://www.grouper.com/c/Funny/Mr_Deity_and_the_Messages_Episode_4/1806036#ml=o%3d12%26fpl%3d68726%26fx%3d

  Can't argue with that
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  Awakened07

  Actually, in biblical times, you could bargain with Jehovah. He had a plan of destroying Sodom and Gomorrah, but hey - Abraham thought "Perhaps we ought to check if there are any righteous people in there first?" - And God said "Oh - you have a point there. I'll go check, and if there are only ten or so I won't do anything. But I'll have to check first. 'Cause I don't know yet. 'Cause I haven't checked. I know I'm almighty and all, but I have to actively go over there and check first. So I'll get back to you. - - - Well, sorry - no righteous people there. Get Lot out of there before I fry the place."

  Not sure if that works anymore though. Abraham was after all a biblical figure, and they were all super humans compared to us, since they're mentioned in the Bible. They weren't just your ordinary Joes. Pretty sure Abraham never had to go to the bathroom. So it probably doesn't work that way with us poor b*stards living in modern times. We are after all not biblical figures.

  Sorry - I'm in a weird mood....
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  minu

  Before I left the borg, I stopped praying. It wasn't doing me any good. I waited and waited on Jah to out my sneaky, two timing bastard husband. I didn't have any "proof". Wives jsut know these things. After 6 years GOD still didn't feel the need to get rid of him. Stopped praying about 1 year before I kicked that sorry excuse for a human out of the house. Haven't prayed since. The ex is still in good standing with the borg. I stopped waiting on Jah and just got rid of the mfker my self.
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  ramtrucker

  This isn't exactly in line with this thread, but I believe it shows that honest, heartfelt prayer to Jehovah will result in help from him.
  
  This story comes from an autobiography handed down to my wife's family written by an ancestor, a great-great-grandfather of my wife.
  
  The story begins when he moves to the United States from Germany in the early, middle 1800s. I won't go into a lot of detail about why he moved here except to say he moved to escape going into the German army.
  
  Not long after he got to the U.S. the War Between the States began, and he was drafted into the Union Army.
  
  Eventually he was captured by Confederate Forces and imprisoned at the prison at Andersonville, which as history has shown us was operated under the most brutal conditions.
  
  The prisoners were ill from many things including sickness stemming from the contaminated water inside the prison grounds which the prisoners were forced to drink.
  
  As the story goes, the men finally got together, held a meeting and prayed to God for help, which especially included pleas for fresh water to be provided.
  
  Within hours, a fresh, clear flowing spring began giving them the pure water they needed.
  
  So at least that part of the prisoners miserable conditions were eliminated.
  
  This story can be verified by research on the internet by the way, although there are some who doubt the veracity of the story.
  
  Since the family has their grandfather's written record of it, I tend to believe that Jehovah did answer the prisoners prayers.
  
  Furthermore, I believe it shows that Jehovah answers not only prayers to him from so called "Witnesses of Jehovah, but men of all faiths.
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  wherehasmyhairgone

  Its difficult to respond to ramtruckers post without it sounding insulting on a personal level.

  This is a rant about pray in general and not specially about ramtruckers comments, but was inspired by them

  But stories like are an insult to every child that died a horrible death a the hands of some predator, every person who drown, while crying at the top of their voices for god to save them.

  To think that on one hand God would provide water to prisoners and in the exact same moment would ignore horrific beating's ,rape, and the list goes on, shows either one of 3 things

  1. God doesn't answer any prayers, which makes him/her heartless

  2. Answers certain prayers, but is quite happy to allow intense suffering on some but not on other

  3. God doesn't exist or isn't what we think he/her/it is.

  My skin crawls when i see some lucky survivors from a natural disaster thank God and that they prayed to god to save them, as that indicates that all the other who died, God didn't answer their prayers.

  I once had the experience of witnesses a serious car accident, and the car flipped many time before a fire broke out, me and a few others pulled this women to safety, unburnt and OK, but shocked. Her first words were, i prayed to Jesus as the car flipped to save me.... So elsewhere in that town that day the Baby that died in the car earlier than day due to heat ( was in the news locally) dies cause..it couldn't pray? or God didn't care, or maybe thought that an 18month old strapped in the car seat should experience extreme heat and death.

  People who claim God saved them or interviewed need a good slap in mouth's insulting every innocent that ever died.

  Yes sometimes we are lucky, sometimes circumstances fall our way, sometimes that might even defy our our reason who something could have happened, but don't be quick to invoke God when you don't know the answer.

  To have the power to save someone and not to, shows cruelty on a universal scale, If God exisited he would be guilty of complacency in the deaths of millions of people,. and to think living under his rule would be a paradise, when he is willing and able to witnesses very young children experience horrific deaths, well....

  I saw a great sign once that said:

  Prayer

  How to do nothing

  and still think you're helping
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  r.a.m.

  No, prayer isn't a waste of time. That's a satanic lie. Ask in prayer, and believe that it will be done. Don't doubt. My guess is that people ask, then they immediately start doubting. Like me...it's an unimportant thing compared to life or health, but there's a wedding I need to go to that's out of town. The problem is that it's three days into the school year where I work. And I need to take Friday and Monday off. So I'm trying to take off the first Friday back and then the next Monday-right after I start work. This is frowned upon. My workmates will be burdened. We have a new principal who may want to set an example with me. And the superintendant may also have to approve it. I prayed about it. Then came the doubts. I doubt if, after I pray, I start in with the "I really hope they approve it" or "If I can't get off for this wedding I'm going to be so upset. What will I do? Will I quit?" See, those are doubts. Therefore, guess what? I was NOT believing that I would receive what I asked for. So now I am practicing(works) my faith, my belief that God can and will make it so that I can go. I can continue on with planning my trip and not doubting that it will fall through.
  
  Some ask why we have to pray if God already knows what we want? You pray because it is by your asking through Jesus that you receive. It is an act of faith. It is working your faith. You know the scripture that the wts screws up, "Faith without works is dead"? Works isn't meetings and service. Works is ACTIVE faith. Believing in your prayers. Asking and then believing that it will be done. NOT DOUBTING AT ALL. My guess is that, like me, you've doubted. It takes a lot of practice to push out doubts, but I have proof within myself that it is possible to push them out and just believe. It's something that I constantly have to practice. I am believing a lie if I believe that my prayer won't be answered.
  
  As far as praying against God's will....we don't always know God's will. I say there's no harm in asking. One person might ask something in full faith and receive it. Another might ask with doubts and not receive. Also, two people might pray for the same thing in full faith and one receives it and another doesn't because it wasn't God's will for that individual. If you ask for something that you know is wrong, such as for a person to die in an awful car crash, it isn't going to happen, I would assume, because you knew it was against God's will and therefore are putting Him to the test.
  
  Waste of time? Maybe me posting this was, but hopefully someone will believe in God and Jesus and the power of prayer and faith.