Help me, this new light confuses me....

by dawg 19 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • dawg
    dawg

    OK, so if they change the rules and allow everyone who feels the spirit to partake of the memorial then that means that there may be no limit on how many are sealed.... am I right?

    If thats' true then ther's no longer a 144K? Right?

    If that's true, what does that mean about the great crowd?

    Isn't it also true that the 144K "annointed ones" are part of the FADS?

    Good lord, if that's true then anuyone who in the FADS that wants to question policy of the FADS can't be dis-fellowshipped. I bet that rule won't change.

    I still don't understand why more don't question John 5: Jesus plainly says that everyone who takes the emblems gets everlasting life. What of the Grest crowd, they don't get everlasting life...

    Sorry, but this was the first thing that made me fall out of the org-the whole unanswerable challenges I made on this subject...and sorry, but this pisses me the hell off!

  • dawg
    dawg

    Help me out here guys, don't let this pass... I',m really confused-or am I?

  • AlphaOmega
    AlphaOmega

    I think that they'll stick with 144,000 until it becomes a problem...

    I guess that the numbers may give them away when they are published (if the correct figures are given)..

    If the numbers aren't published, people may notice more people partaking and start to do a little chatting between congregations, but how will they see the big picture ??? The internet ??

    Good lord, if that's true then anuyone who in the FADS that wants to question policy of the FADS can't be dis-fellowshipped. I bet that rule won't change.

    The article about 1935 (2007 May 1st QFR), says that anointed ones aren't as special as "experienced Christians"... it was basically an article to keep them in line.

  • AlphaOmega
    AlphaOmega

    Questions From Readers - May 1st 2007

    When does the calling of Christians to a heavenly hope cease?

    The Bible does not reveal a precise answer to that question. We do know that the anointing of Jesus' disciples with a view to their heavenly inheritance began in 33 C.E. (Acts 2:1-4) We also know that after the death of the apostles, genuine anointed Christian "wheat" came to "grow together" with counterfeit Christians, "weeds." (Matthew 13:24-30) Then, starting in the late 1800's, anointed Christians were again prominently active. In 1919 "the harvest of the earth," including the gathering of the final ones of the anointed, began to be reaped.—Revelation 14:15, 16.

    From the late 1800's until 1931, the main thrust of the preaching work was the gathering of the remaining members of the body of Christ. In 1931 the Bible Students took the Bible-based name Jehovah's Witnesses, and in the November 15, 1933, issue of The Watchtower, the thought was expressed that this unique name was the "denarius" referred to in Jesus' parable recorded at Matthew 20:1-16. The 12 hours mentioned in the parable were thought to correspond to the 12 years from 1919 to 1931. For many years after that, it was believed that the call to the heavenly Kingdom had ended in 1931 and that those called to be joint heirs with Christ in 1930 and 1931 were "the last" called. (Matthew 20:6-8) However, in 1966 an adjusted understanding of that parable was presented, and it became clear that it had nothing to do with the end of the calling of the anointed.

    In 1935 the "great crowd" of Revelation 7: 9-15 was understood to be made up of "other sheep," Christians with an earthly hope, who would appear on the world scene in "the last days" and who as a group would survive Armageddon. (John 10:16; 2 Timothy 3:1; Revelation 21:3, 4) After that year, the thrust of the disciple-making work turned to the gathering in of the great crowd. Hence, especially after 1966 it was believed that the heavenly call ceased in 1935. This seemed to be confirmed when almost all who were baptized after 1935 felt that they had the earthly hope. Thereafter, any called to the heavenly hope were believed to be replacements for anointed Christians who had proved unfaithful.

    Without a doubt, if one of the anointed unrepentantly falls away, Jehovah does call another individual to take his place. (Romans 11:17-22) However, the number of genuine anointed ones who have become unfaithful is likely not large. On the other hand, as time has gone by, some Christians baptized after 1935 have had witness borne to them that they have the heavenly hope. (Romans 8:16, 17) Thus, it appears that we cannot set a specific date for when the calling of Christians to the heavenly hope ends.

    How should a person be viewed who has determined in his heart that he is now anointed and begins to partake of the emblems at the Memorial?He should not be judged. The matter is between him and Jehovah. (Romans 14:12) However, genuine anointed Christians do not demand special attention. They do not believe that their being of the anointed gives them special "insights," beyond what even some experienced members of the great crowd may have. They do not believe that they necessarily have more holy spirit than their companions of the other sheep have; nor do they expect special treatment or claim that their partaking of the emblems places them above the appointed elders in the congregation. They humbly remember that some anointed men in the first century did not qualify to serve as elders or ministerial servants. (1 Timothy 3:1-10, 12, 13; Titus 1:5-9; James 3:1) Some anointed Christians were even spiritually weak. (1 Thessalonians 5:14) And sisters, although anointed, did not teach in the congregation.—1 Timothy 2:11, 12.

    Hence, anointed Christians along with their other sheep companions strive to stay spiritually strong, cultivating the fruitage of the spirit and working for the peace of the congregation. All Christians, whether anointed or of the other sheep, work hard at preaching the good news and making disciples under the direction of the Governing Body. Anointed Christians are content to do this for as long as it is God's will that they remain on earth as Jehovah's servants.

  • journey-on
    journey-on

    Just wait on Jehovah. He'll reveal everything in his own due time.

    Seriously though. I think this is going to be one of those things where they will simply stop publishing the numbers

    of those partaking and say that it is due to some of the people misunderstanding the teaching or due to apostate antics. That way

    none of the rank and file will know how many remnant are left and will be told to just "leave it in Jehovah's hands. He will reveal things to his

    FDS as the light gets brighter and brighter and the end draws to a close. Trust us." The rank and file will carry on as usual and never bat

    an eye.

  • shopaholic
    shopaholic

    Dawg, you're not confused at all. You've actually seen the light. I've known a number of folks over the years that have partaken of the emblems even though they didn't "qualify" based on what we've been taught. Ha...a friend of mine did this at the memorial this year and everyone thought she had flipped her mind. With this "new light" a number of the "great crowd" will start partaking and then after a few years they will adjust the teaching again. Because if everyone is partaking, how will they know the remnant count for annual stats in the watchtower? It going to jump from 8,000 to 200,000 people partaking...LOL...because every congregational nut, every bible study and newly baptized person is gonna partake!!!!

    And yeah, you're not the only one that's pissed off by this! But it makes me happy at the same time because at least somebody is going leave the org based on this twisted light. If I was still in, I would leave!!!

  • choosing life
    choosing life

    They have changed the teaching that the cutting off date for being chosen as an annointed was 1935. I think there will still be some stigma attached to anyone who begins partaking though. Nothing official, just the usual talk. As far as dropping the literal number of 144,000, they have not officially done that yet. I believe they will soon as the numbers will continue to go up for the annointed. Or maybe they just will quit counting them.

    As far as the annointed being part of the faithful and discreet slave, they already covered their backsides on that. They came out in the article where they dropped 1935 and said they were officially nothing special. They certainly cannot question the governing body as we saw in the experience of Franz and others. They really just set the GB up even more like the pope. Their current understanding of the scriptures is infallible.

    When they changed the generation teaching, it had a big effect on me too. I was asured by the fact that the generation that saw 1914 would see the end. The new explanation was absurd. It was one of the things that got the ball rolling for me too. Nothing is too strange in the watchtower world anymore.

    It is certain to go downhill with the cult copy of the watchtower coming out.

  • Alwayshere
    Alwayshere

    dawg, you already helped yourself by getting out. They are always having a "new light". It's run by apostates and thats why.

  • tula
    tula

    The 144,000 were resurrected and left at the time Jesus was crucified.

    It's right there in the scriptures. Matthew 27:52-53. Go read it.

    Part of the diversion is that wbts picks and chooses what you read.

    about memorial.....

    "An ethnobotanist in Santa Cruz, California, thinks Jesus was munching magic mushrooms at the Last Supper. Clark Heinrich says man has enjoyed the psychedelic effects of mushrooms since thousands of years before Christ -- and figured the King of Kings probably turned on as well.

    Heinrich says the mushroom resembles pita bread and when soaked with water it feels exactly like human skin. He figures that's the bread that Jesus was referring to at the last supper when he said "eat this bread, this is my body."

    Heinrich is the author of a new book, "Magic Mushrooms In Religion And Alchemy" "

    but they'll have to come out formerly and denounce the 114 if numbers rise beyind that. Won't they?

    Dawg...really...who would know for sure what the numbers really are? All you know for sure is what THEY TELL YOU in the publication. All you can see for yourself is in your own little congo. Those published numbers can be skewed any way they want to. And paperwork can get lost.

    I think their purpose for this is twofold: to uphold the new light on "generations" and to get and keep new members

    I am a firm believer if you give someone enough rope they will eventually hang themselves.

    So think about the impact and reaction this will have on the long time members. Those who have been so down-trodden and tried so hard to be perfect. Then along comes some newbie partaking in memorial. And you know this person has not had the years of truth and discipline you have had. Nor the trials. You know you are wiser and more tested.

    Don't you think a big resentment will creep into the congs? Just my opinion.

    But look farther down the road, dawg. What do YOU see happening when this actually comes into play?

  • dawg
    dawg

    I hear what you guys are saying, but they'll have to come out formerly and denounce the 114 if numbers rise beyind that. Won't they? Man, how can people still beleive this nonsence? Apparently i've got it right then... hard to believe.

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit