Hi again S.G.
I think it was "Frenchy" that gave you some good advice. It's one thing to"defend your faith" but quite another to try and address every question put to you. That could put you under one awful burden. You really do not need that. Take your time, relax and follow Jehovah's councel in the Bible. Romans 12:2 in part" ..."prove TO YOURSELF the good and acceptable and perfect will of God". When that is fully accomlished you will easily defend your faith. But you do not have to prove anything to anyone by feeling that you have to answer every question. Of course the way to prove everything to yourself is by "testing" everything that you are taught. If the Bible supports everything that you believe and you can stand with that Book in your hand and supply the required "two or three witnesses" for everything that you believe and those witnesses are fully in harmony with your teaching then you have proven it to yourself. That is what is really important. 1 Thessalonians 5: 21 in the Beck translation it reads:"But test everything and cling to what is good".Taking in knowledge is like eating fish with many bones in it. Some of those bones can literally choke you to death. Knowing that you spit them out. Is it not even more important when taking in spiritual food to quickly spit out a teaching or an interpretation that has no witnesses to suport it? In the finale mildly accepting religious teachings that are not in the Bible or that are outright false teachings will bring the same effect as a large fishbone caught in your throat. Anyway do not try and prove anything to me. Prove it to yourself. That is what will bring you many benefits. That is what will bring all of us many benefits. Bill Parker
active and happy jw
by scumgrief 151 Replies latest jw friends
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Bill Parker
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joelbear
I agree with Bill.
I can only speak for myself when I say, you have nothing to prove to me.
I have researched my concerns fully myself, using the Bible and other text books. I have come to my own conclusions regarding god and life and nothing I have read here has changed my current beliefs, although I continue to read and attempt to absorb different avenues of thought.
You certainly have the right to your viewpoints. I too am interested in discussions that involve an active witness who is thoughtful and considerate and not just some nutcase as we have always had here.
take care
Joel
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4horsemen
Exactly JoelBear
SG will get around to questions and we'll get to know his perspective as he posts in other threads. The dog pile is on because as we well know when we were dubs to find a JW even _willing_ to have an open mind and discuss not Babylon the Great faults, but the "true" religion without calling everyone who can demonstrate credible proofs Apostate, is well, uncommon.
Off topic to Bridgette:
I only know you from your posts but I am (not just happy) but proud of you for pursuing you college degree. Dont beat yourself up with your imagined old age in relation to what is "normal" for college timeframe. Only 22% of the working population in US has a college degree. Whether they are 21,31, or 51. Give yourself many pats on the back.
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serenaj92
Scum,
What did the elders say when you informed them that you were coming to this forum?Didn't they "advise" against it? That is what they used to do to me for my music and activities other than field service. They didn't say no, but they advised against it, or encouraged me not to do this, and if I didn't take their advise, they and others in the congregation magically kept their distance from me. Like all of a sudden, they were busy, didn't get my phone messages, or just forgot.
Serena -
Bridgette
Thanks 4! I am proud of myself for living life to the fullest on many fronts, now. I would just rather have a degree out of the way by now. But, no regrets. I'm thankful for what I have.
Thanks again,
Bridgette -
battman
hi again scummer,
< I'll do my best to defend my beliefs, but we both know
that eventually it will just end up in a stalemate.>Yikes, what is the point being here then if the matter is
pre judged? BTW you just gave me an area we can talk
about. I am totally lost when it comes to the concept of
fore-ordination and fore-knowledge. Have read the info in
the Aid to Bible Understanding and Insight books and more
confused than when I started.Also I fought the JW religion for 6 years before deciding
to be baptised. Then I was in for 25 years and now very
inactive so IMHO I hope that I can be open to new ideas,
fresh viewpoints based on an organized logic. After all
is not Jah a God of Organization and logic? Looking
forward to your response.Batty Battman
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teejay
I believe that my faith is strong enough to prevent me from jeopardizing anything by being here.
In a way, this reminds me of me, Scumgrief!
Nearly thirty years ago when I was a teen attending the District Conventions, sometimes I would mosey outside during the lunch break to get some sun and fresh air. Even though young in years, I wouldn't hesitate to talk to "apostates" that were outside. I was confident in my faith and firmly believed that the truth I had would stand any challenge. For a long time, it did.
Once, a JW 'policeman' came by and more or less told me to move on, that I shouldn't be talking to the woman I was talking to. I let the brother know that I appreciated his effort, but I would talk to whomever I wished, thank you very much. At that point, Brother Gestapo became mad at TWO people. He did the right thing by leaving me alone, though, I can tell you that!
Anyway, like I said yesterday, don't feel as though you must defend your beliefs (or the Society) TO ANYONE. It's apparent that you already know this, but you are completely within your rights to be happy believing whatever you choose to believe. Everyone else does.
Again, I'm glad you're here.
Peace,
tj..................................
I was going to buy a copy of The Power of Positive Thinking, and then I thought: What the hell good would that do? -- Ronnie Shakes -
jst2laws
Dear Scumgrief,
You sound like me on this board just 8 months ago.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=3642&site=3Hope you stay around. As Joy2bfree said, there is much to be learned here and a lot of kind persons. You will eventually see things that disturb you. Try not to blame God. Looking forward to more of your thoughts.
Jst2laws
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Bill Parker
Hi S.G.
This is just a thought on a point focused on by Name with held.
"I am sure Jehovah will give the correct guidance regarding it." I have had the scripture at Amos 3:7 read to me many times by those who have been trying to prove to me that the Society gains special knowledge from Jehovah at various intervals in time. In the the Amplified Bible it is worded: " Surely the LORD GOD will do nothing without revealing His secret to His servants the Prophets." Jehovah has already revealed everything that He wants His servants the Prophets to know. It is all within the pages of the Bible. The only thing that is not revealed is the exact "DAY AND HOUR" His intervention will come. We do not tread into an area belonging solely to Him. Reread 2 Timothy 3:16 It takes up too much space to quote all of the scriptures I may need to cover here! In the first century Jehovah gave revelations to various one's in the congregations. Read 1 Corinthians 14: 26-33. We know from scripture that both classes were there in the first century. We also know that Jehovah "does not show partiality"choosing to give these Revelations to only the Heavenly Calling. He would choose the "one looked down upon" to give a special revelation to so that "no flesh would boast in the sight of God" It must be stated though that he would not have used someone who was a willful practicer of sin. That goes without saying.1 Corinthians 1: 27-29 The revelations at that time were part and parcel with the "gifts of the Spirit" which were "done away with"in the first century as you already know.
This knowledge now comes through the effort put forth by each individual in "searching the scriptures" How did the Bible writer instruct us to gain this knowledge? " Take pains with these things, be absorbed in them;so that your progress may be evident to all" In harmony with this direction is the scripture at Proverbs 2:1-6 This scripture if you do not already remember what it say's there is a MUST TO READ! IT really clearly shows how one gains this special knowledge today. It is Jehovah who does the teaching through His HOLY SPIRIT!As Jesus said "the Holy Spirit will bring back to your minds all that I said to you" John 14:26. 1 John 2:26,27 really shows clearly how one is taught today. There is "no lie" when one really is instructed by Jehovah. If he is being instructed the light that he receives doesn't blink on and off with ever changing teachings. Knowledge is progressive. Each flash of light brings one closer and closer to the true knowledge until the day dawns when each one will have a comrehensive knowledge of Jehovah. The only way these flashes of light come today is not because of any special revelations as was known in the first century. It is by pouring over the pages of the Bible. It's all there all we have to do is dig for it like hidden treasure. When we do that we will "FIND THE VERY KNOWLEDGE OF GOD" Bill Parker -
AMarie
YoYo Mama, if you're still around:
You said, "Will there be a destruction? Yes
Will millions even billions perish? Yes
Who's fault is it that they will perish? Their own.
Has Jehovah given them the opportunity to change? we're still in this old system aren't we?
How many perished in Noah's day because they did not listen to the warnings? How many perished in the destruction of Jerusalem by Babylon because they did not listen? How many died in 70 C.E. because they did not pay attention to Jesus' words? More that a million Jews. Who's fault was it? Their own."I think that you are forgetting that the bible is subject to each person/religion's interpretation. I know that all Christian religions know the basic teachings of the bible, ie Thou Shall not kill, Thou shall not steal, etc. That is something that we all can agree on. However, who are you to say that the JW teachings on heaven and hell, etc are the only ones that are correct and that people who don't follow these doctrines are going to perish?
When I first left the "truth", I went to see a pastor about JW teachings versus typical christian teachings. I strutted in there with my reasoning book and bible thinking I was going to show him a thing or to. However, he showed me from my own bible the numerous verses that support Christian theory on heaven, hell, trinity, etc. He actually made alot of sense. Is his religion the only religion accepted by god? No. Nor did he claim is was.
After blowing my argument completely out of the water, he continued to put emphasis on being a good person and helping fellow man. For example, people from his church help the homeless on weekends, travel to third world countries to build homes for the poor. You mean to tell me that because this god fearing, kink man doesn't believe in your exact doctrines, he is going to perish and it will be his own fault? I find that extremely hard to believe.