Jesus as Michael (page 4)

NewTruth

Dear MOG..

Don't you think that the Lord Jesus having an 'arch angel's voice' means that he has some close affinity with the arch angel, having his voice?

absolutely ...I just do not seeing being actually Michael..Although what has me scratching my head is that the name itself means "who is like God", and as we know Immanuel means "God with us"..but that probably does not mean much, its probably THE GOD show authority that all these beings are created to his liking..its like stamping a last name with intimacy..branding??

NewTruth

Hi Mog... Interesting point about the names meanings.

Another point is that whenever Michael is used in reference to the second coming, he's not called 'arch angel' but rather just 'Michael'. So, I'm thinking on the return, Michael is no longer an arch angel but just has an 'arch angels' voice..

Kphoto

Hello all, I like the discussion but I still havn't seen anything scriptural that show Jesus and Michael being the same.

MOG

Just for fun - the name Gabriel means "God is my strength" - it seems clear by looking at all these names, that Immanuel has the highest meaning..In my opinion

lovelylil

newtruth,

where does it say Jesus is the one shouting "with the archangels voice?". It says in 1 Thess. that the Lord (Jesus) descends from heaven "with" the voice of the archangel. It does not say Jesus HAS a voice of the archangel. Please see my research already posted. "with" means accompanied by.

It would make sense when Christ returns as King that his return is announced since he is royalty. The Archangel will shout out the announcement, hence Christ comes or descends "with" this shout and also the Trump of God is playing. The text also says the Lord ascends "with" the trump of God. So is Jesus the trump of God too? Or is he making the trump of God sound? No. Again he comes "with" these 2 things, not that he is them.

Like you said it too, there is NO scripture that directly states Jesus is Michael. All texts refer to him as Son of Man, God's son, Lord, Master, not one calls him an Angel or Michael.

According to the Book of Enoch, ancient Jews believed in many Archangels including Michael, Gabriel, Uriel and Raphael. Lilly

kurtbethel

I asked my study conductor about the Michael/Jesus identities when I saw it asserted in the Revelation Climax book. He had me look up in Daniel and Jude, and it was very obvious thar Jesus and Michael were not the same person.

It was then that I realized, and pointed out to him, that Watchtower Jesus and Bible Jesus are two different Jesii.

NewTruth

Hello friends.... Lilly, I see your point... Yet, if it wasnt' his voice, than it may has said, 'the lord returns with Michael the archangel, rather than with the voice of the archangel. Returning with the voice, to me, more implies that Jesus' voice is that of the archangel. But your way of looking at it is a possibly. I don't put alot of stock into the extra books.. as I've tried to read Enoch before.

Mog: You mentioned that in Rev.. there is Jesus talked of, and then Michael..why not consistency? Jesus is mentioned as talking to John, but when the second coming is mentioned, the name Jesus, does not seem to be used. Apparently Jesus is not called Jesus on the second coming. The term, lamb, is however used.. and 'son of man'. And it's cool to look at the different meanings of the names.

Like I was thinking before.. when Michael is used it is in texts that are signs and symbols, revelation for example.. So, it would be something to figure out, like the rest of Rev.. Not one of the straight forward things..

RebelWife

1 Thessalonians 4:16 16For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud cry of summons, with the shout of an "archangel", and with the blast of the trumpet of God.

"An" indicates there is more than one archangel, so how could it indicate a specificone? Saying "the" trumpet indicates there is only one trumpet.

hence Christ comes or descends "with" this shout and also the Trump of God is playing. The text also says the Lord ascends "with" the trump of God. So is Jesus the trump of God too? Or is he making the trump of God sound? No. Again he comes "with" these 2 things, not that he is them.

Exactly! The shout and the trumpet are even in the same sentence. He rode with the urgency of Paul Revere. Must mean he is Paul Revere. He spoke with the fire of Martin Luther King, Jr. Must be MLK, Jr.

MOG

bowing out..2nd post today I am bowing out..hahah.. darn it..

thanks for you insights and opinions and beliefs..etc..

Jesus as Michael

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