Way to go, Dubya!

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  • nvrgnbk
    nvrgnbk

    Bush's Comments In Israel Fuel Anger

    Linking of Nazis, Iran Seen as Jab at Obama

    Video

    Bush: America Stands With Israel President Bush, in Jerusalem to help celebrate the 60th anniversary of the State of Israel, told Israeli lawmakers that the United States is firm in its commitment to the friendship between the two nations. » LAUNCH VIDEO PLAYER By Michael Abramowitz Washington Post Staff Writer
    Friday, May 16, 2008; Page A08

    JERUSALEM, May 15 -- On an emotional visit to mark Israel's 60th anniversary, President Bush on Thursday compared people seeking talks with Iran and radical Islamic groups to the Nazis' appeasers, provoking a political storm at home and accusations that he was politicizing the celebration.

    Bush's address to the Israeli parliament also stirred intense debate between Israelis and Palestinians. His strong words of empathy for Israel brought lawmakers in the tiny chamber to their feet.

    Palestinians expressed disappointment afterward that Bush did not use the occasion to press the Israelis forcefully to make compromises toward the creation of a Palestinian state. While Bush has frequently promoted that goal, the only reference in the speech came when he looked forward to the 120th anniversary of Israel and the prospect of a changed Middle East.

    "The Palestinian people will have the homeland they have long dreamed of and deserved -- a democratic state that is governed by law, and respects human rights, and rejects terror," Bush said.

    Saeb Erekat, a senior Palestinian negotiator, called the speech a missed opportunity. Bush should have used the forum to address the urgency of ending the conflict, he said: "We shouldn't have to wait 60 more years for a Palestinian state."

    Bush's comments about appeasement reverberated across the U.S. campaign trail, offering a new platform for Sen. Barack Obama (D-Ill.) and Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) to sharpen their lines of attack.

    In the speech, Bush warned that the United States must not negotiate with Iran or radical groups such as Hamas.

    "Some seem to believe we should negotiate with the terrorists and radicals, as if some ingenious argument will persuade them they have been wrong all along," Bush told the Israeli lawmakers. "We have heard this foolish delusion before. As Nazi tanks crossed into Poland in 1939, an American senator declared: 'Lord, if only I could have talked to Hitler, all of this might have been avoided.' We have an obligation to call this what it is -- the false comfort of appeasement, which has been repeatedly discredited by history."

    Democrats angrily called the comment a veiled shot at Obama, who has advocated dialogue with Iran and Syria, but not the Palestinian group Hamas.

    "We have a protocol . . . around here that we don't criticize the president when he is on foreign soil," said House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.). "One would think that that would apply to the president, that he would not criticize Americans when he is on foreign soil. I think what the president did in that regard is beneath the dignity of the office of president and unworthy of our representation at that observance in Israel."

    Sen. Joseph R. Biden Jr. (D-Del.), chairman of the Foreign Relations Committee, used an expletive to describe Bush's comment. He went on to say: "For this president to leave the country and unleash a political attack on Senator Obama and the Democrats cannot go unanswered. We're not going to tolerate this swiftboating," he said, referring to the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth campaign in 2004 to impugn the war record of Sen. John F. Kerry (Mass.), the Democratic nominee.

    Democratic leaders demanded that McCain repudiate Bush's comments, but McCain joined in on Bush's side. "Why does Senator Obama want to sit down with a state sponsor of terrorism? What does Senator Obama want to talk about with [Iranian President Mahmoud] Ahmadinejad?" McCain asked reporters while campaigning in Ohio.

    "Yes, there have been appeasers in the past," McCain added. "The president is absolutely right." Asked whether he thought Obama was one of them, he said he didn't know.

    In a statement, Obama responded to what he called "a false political attack," saying, "George Bush knows that I have never supported engagement with terrorists, and the President's extraordinary politicization of foreign policy and the politics of fear do nothing to secure the American people or our stalwart ally Israel."

    White House press secretary Dana Perino dismissed the Democrats' complaints, saying that Bush's remarks were not directed at Obama. "This is not new policy that the president announced, and it should come as no surprise to anybody that the president would talk about this," Perino said.

    Obama is far from the only politician who has advocated a renewed dialogue with Iran to try to get it to give up its nuclear-enrichment programs. A smaller number of U.S. politicians, including former president Jimmy Carter, have said the United States should talk to Hamas.

    In his speech to the Knesset, Israel's parliament, Bush said the incendiary language of Hamas and the armed Lebanese Islamist group Hezbollah must be taken seriously. He invoked the legacy of the Holocaust, citing Hamas's call for the "elimination" of Israel, Hezbollah followers' chants of "Death to Israel, death to America" and the Iranian president's vow to wipe the Jewish state off the map.

    "There are good and decent people who cannot fathom the darkness in these men and try to explain away their words. It is natural," Bush said. "But it is deadly wrong. As witnesses to evil in the past, we carry a solemn responsibility to take these words seriously. Jews and Americans have seen the consequences of disregarding the words of leaders who espouse hatred."

    The Knesset address was the centerpiece of Bush's two-day visit to Israel, timed to coincide with the 60th anniversary. Bush also paid a visit to Masada, the Dead Sea fortress where Jewish rebels are said to have killed themselves almost 2,000 years ago rather than submit to Roman rule. He brought the Knesset audience to its feet when he vowed, "Masada shall never fall again, and America will be at your side."

    Many Israelis admire Bush for his strong support of their actions against militants and his unwillingness to pressure their government in negotiations with the Palestinians, though there is also considerable sentiment here that the administration should have pushed harder for a peace deal during the past seven years.

    Administration officials counter that conditions have not been ripe for a settlement because, in their view, the Palestinian leadership has been an unreliable partner for peace until recently.

    The speech to the Knesset gave Bush an up-close view of Israel's raucous politics. His appearance was boycotted by the Arab members of the legislature, who number about a dozen, though three did appear with protest signs reading "We Shall Overcome." Two members who oppose creation of a Palestinian state left in protest when Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, in introducing Bush, spoke of a two-state solution to the conflict.

    Bush also heard from opposition leader and former prime minister Binyamin Netanyahu, who drew applause from some quarters of the chamber when he declared that any peace deal would have to leave Jerusalem "intact under Israeli sovereignty" -- a controversial point because Palestinians also lay claim to a city considered the third holiest in Islam.

    "It's a rare privilege to address the Knesset," Bush said, when it was finally his turn to speak, "and the prime minister told me there was something even rarer. To have just one person in the chamber speaking at a time."

    Correspondent Griff Witte in Jerusalem and staff writers Michael D. Shear and Jonathan Weisman in Washington contributed to this report.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/15/AR2008051500733.html?hpid=topnews

  • freydi
  • Gopher
    Gopher

    For Bush to use modern Israel's 60th anniversary as an opportunity for political gain -- is beyond despicable. And consider, did Israel whole-heartedly support America's incursion into Iraq a few years back? Not from what I've heard.

    So Obama is now an "appeaser" on the level of Neville Chamberlain? Ludicrous. America is already conducting low-level talks with the Iranian government. Is the current administration appeasing Ahmadinejad?

    All Obama is saying is that you have to bring your enemies to the table, and keep talks going. That's Diplomacy 101, something the current administration lost sight of as it created enemies for the next American president to deal with.

    It's like the old Chinese saying (quoted in The Godfather): "Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer."

    Appeasing would be trying to bribe your enemy somehow (giving them land, money, etc.) to get them to behave when it's clear that they won't.

  • BurnTheShips
    BurnTheShips
    "Some seem to believe we should negotiate with the terrorists and radicals, as if some ingenious argument will persuade them they have been wrong all along," Bush told the Israeli lawmakers. "We have heard this foolish delusion before. As Nazi tanks crossed into Poland in 1939, an American senator declared: 'Lord, if only I could have talked to Hitler, all of this might have been avoided.' We have an obligation to call this what it is -- the false comfort of appeasement, which has been repeatedly discredited by history."
    "There are good and decent people who cannot fathom the darkness in these men and try to explain away their words. It is natural," Bush said. "But it is deadly wrong. As witnesses to evil in the past, we carry a solemn responsibility to take these words seriously. Jews and Americans have seen the consequences of disregarding the words of leaders who espouse hatred."

    That is what Bush acutally said. Without spin. This is an accurate statement of a position held by many and not just Americans. He did not name names. He did not criticize any Americans. Apparently his Israeli audience agreed, because they applauded heartily.

    I think the Democrats are making a tempest in a teapot for political gain here.

    Obama:

    "George Bush knows that I have never supported engagement with terrorists, and the President's extraordinary politicization of foreign policy and the politics of fear do nothing to secure the American people or our stalwart ally Israel."

    This is a lie, Obama supports "engagement", and these people can't wait until he wins the Presidency.

    Hitting A Nerve

    By INVESTOR'S BUSINESS DAILY | Posted Thursday, May 15, 2008 4:20 PM PT

    Foreign Policy: Barack Obama claims he's not an appeaser. But when President Bush attacked those who "seem to believe we should negotiate with terrorists," why was the senator sure he was talking about him?

    "The lady doth protest too much, methinks" is the famous Hamlet quote referring to pleas of innocence that actually indicate guilt. Did Obama, the near-certain Democratic Party nominee for president, "protest too much" in complaining about Bush's speech to Israel's Knesset on Thursday?

    Addressing lawmakers in Jerusalem in a special session of the legislature commemorating the 60th anniversary of the establishment of the state of Israel, the president made comments with which few Americans could find fault.

    "Some seem to believe that we should negotiate with the terrorists and radicals, as if some ingenious argument will persuade them they have been wrong all along," the president said.

    "We have heard this foolish delusion before. As Nazi tanks crossed into Poland in 1939, an American senator declared: 'Lord, if I could only have talked to Hitler, all this might have been avoided.' "

    According to the president, "We have an obligation to call this what it is — the false comfort of appeasement, which has been repeatedly discredited by history."

    That infamous senator, William Edgar Borah of Idaho, wasn't even a Democrat; he was a "progressive" Republican, an isolationist who in 1919 helped wreck Woodrow Wilson's internationalist dream of a League of Nations. So why would Obama issue such a stinging statement in response to the president's remarks?

    Obama called it "sad" that he used such a speech "to launch a false political attack." He added: "It is time to turn the page on eight years of policies that have strengthened Iran and failed to secure America or our ally Israel.

    "Instead of tough talk and no action, we need to do what Kennedy, Nixon and Reagan did and use all elements of American power — including tough, principled and direct diplomacy — to pressure countries like Iran and Syria."

    According to the senator, "George Bush knows that I have never supported engagement with terrorists, and the president's extraordinary politicization of foreign policy and the politics of fear do nothing to secure the American people or our stalwart ally Israel."

    Judging from the standing ovations the president received, our Israeli allies — who have the most to fear from a nuclear Iran — disagree. Moreover, Kennedy's blockade of Cuba, Nixon's Vietnamization (reneged on by the post-Watergate Democratic Congress) and Reagan's years of defense buildup and "evil empire" saber-rattling before agreeing to a Soviet summit all belie Obama's invocation of those presidents.

    Furthermore, the terrorists themselves know a President Obama will engage with them. The chief political adviser to Hamas' Gaza leader Ismail Haniyeh is on record as saying, "We like Mr. Obama, and we hope he will win the election."

    Earlier this month, Obama described the takeover of West Beirut by Hezbollah gunmen as a "power grab" and declared, "It's time to engage in diplomatic efforts to help build a new Lebanese consensus."

    Letters found on the seized computer of Raul Reyes, the warlord with Colombia's Marxist-Leninist FARC terrorist group who was killed in an army strike in March, happily reported that "two gringos" he met assured him that Obama would win the election.

    "Lord, if I could only have talked to Mahmoud" will be words of little comfort to future victims of nuclear terrorism.

  • SacrificialLoon
    SacrificialLoon

    Good thing we never talked with those radical Soviets.

  • BurnTheShips
    BurnTheShips
    Good thing we never talked with those radical Soviets.

    Without preconditions?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSFSUbMWenU

    From his own site.

    Diplomacy: Obama is the only major candidate who supports tough, direct presidential diplomacy with Iran without preconditions. Now is the time to pressure Iran directly to change their troubling behavior. Obama would offer the Iranian regime a choice. If Iran abandons its nuclear program and support for terrorism, we will offer incentives like membership in the World Trade Organization, economic investments, and a move toward normal diplomatic relations. If Iran continues its troubling behavior, we will step up our economic pressure and political isolation. Seeking this kind of comprehensive settlement with Iran is our best way to make progress.

    That means without Iran guaranteeing anything at all, let alone denuclearization, or at the very least promising to stop supplying the Iraqi Shia militias with the shaped charge explosives that are killing scores of American troops in Iraq. If Iran gave up its nuclear weapons program today, Bush would open diplomatic contacts with Iran and might even consider a summit. Bush has been very clear on that. He has even held out the carrot of a World Trade Organization sponsorship and normalized relations in exchange for just that very thing.

    Has Obama ever explained how sitting down with Ahmadinejad would stop Iran from being the crazed totatlitarian theocracy that it is? There are efforts on the part of regular Iranians to change the regime. Instead of supporting these. Obama would simply legitimize the regime instead by giving it a voice. Ahmadinejad has held regional conferences praising a world where Israel would be wiped off the map and the US would no longer exist. To meet with this animal without preconditions would hand the hardliners a tremendous advantage in controlling their own restive population. Neville met Hitler without preconditions, and came back with a worthless piece of paper.

    BTS

  • freydi
    freydi

    Sunday, August 27, 2006

    Cheney Spends Vacation Clubbing Baby Seals

    Miramichi, New Brunswick - Vice President Cheney, while vacationing in the picturesque Canadian community of Miramichi, decided he could use some relaxing recreation so he joined a group of local hunters on a outing to harvest the pelts of baby seals.

    Using a club bearing the vice presidential seal, Cheney took to the task with relish and, in the course of the afternoon, personally clubbed to death 14 baby seals. In one particularly impressive display of clubbing skill, the vice president, with a single swing of his club, dispatched a mother harp seal that was attempting to protect her young pup. Then, with another swing of his club, he knocked the pup unconscious whereupon its pelt was removed.

    Obviously pleased with his performance, a blood-stained Cheney joined the other hunters in the time-honored tradition of eating the liver of their prey as a sign of their prowess. Said Cheney, "Eating raw liver from a freshly clubbed baby seal whose heart is still beating is one of the greatest joys in the world. It just doesn't get any better than this."

    The vice president is planning to turn this into an annual event and next year will take his wife and daughters along so they can make it a family affair.

    http://assimilatedpress.blogspot.com/2006/08/cheney-spends-vacation-clu_115667304524479695.html

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=IWfIhFhelm8&feature=related

  • SacrificialLoon
    SacrificialLoon

    You're right BTS, Bush's negotiation tactics have been hugely successful in the middle east so far, we should continue with the neocon methodology. Instead of "Peace in our time." we got "Mission accomplished". You can use bombs instead of words and still be inept.

  • Carlos_Helms
    Carlos_Helms

    I might be a little "old world," but negotiating with criminals has always meant compromising with criminals - which is what they depend upon. I'm for no negotiations with the current leadership of the Palestinians. They have not demonstrated, to me anyway, that they have the best interests of Palestinians at heart. You don't form a nation out of hatred for or the destruction of another nation. To negotiate with Hamas can only mean disadvantage for the Jews....which is unacceptable. I saw nothing at all wrong with "Dubya's" comments. Kind of calling a spade a spade.

    Peace,
    Carlos

  • BurnTheShips
    BurnTheShips
    You're right BTS, Bush's negotiation tactics have been hugely successful in the middle east so far, we should continue with the neocon methodology.

    We've got a feud in the ME spanning millenia and I doubt anyone is going to solve it anytime soon.

    Instead of "Peace in our time." we got "Mission accomplished".

    That stupid sign on the aircraft carrier was not the Administration's idea.

    You can use bombs instead of words and still be inept.

    Agreed, very inept, in this case.

    BTS

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