What is this about Marking?

by Missie Eff 18 Replies latest jw friends

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  Missie Eff

  I have a good freind here with me this evening. (Celtic, if you're around you know her - it's Liane)

  There is something that has always puzzled both of us. Liane was "marked" a few years ago for having a relationship with a "Worldly" man (hardly "worldy", he was completely frigid by all acounts - much to my freind's disappointment).

  Until this happened, I had never heard of this practice before. She was not disfellowshipped but the other members of the congregation were not allowed to talk to her apart from in the Kingdom Hall. My husband and I were regularly bugged by the elders because we refused to break our freindship with her - and as a consequence were threatened with disfellowshipping ourselves and lost all of our freinds within the congregation.

  Even when the relationship finished (they were engaged at the time), she was still "marked" for some months afterwards. She was told that the elders could not "unmark" her because she had not been "marked" as such - the congregation were to just see her as someone not to associate socially with. A talk had been given about this over the platform and it was made pretty plain about who this applied to.

  In order for Liane to be accepted back into the congregation, a sign was given, in the form of an elder and his wife inviting her around for lunch. But nothing was said over the platform.

  Reasons for this course of action were given, naturally, from the Organize to Accomplish your Ministry book - but the explanation seemed a little shady at the time.

  What we want to know is if anyone else has encountered the same experience - as far as we know it is relatively rare. Does this procedure happen outside of this area (Cornwall, UK)?

  If only the elders really knew what she was up to......
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  Lindy

  This is stupid. The marking, you can look it up, is only supposed to be done on an individual basis, not congregationally. It shows where the power lies in some congregations and what elders have control of such things.
  Marking is done by each person on the matter of whom you see might not be "good" association. You would talk with this person at the Hall and out in service, but outside of the Hall and other "spiritual" public activities you would associate with whom you would consider "up building" association. You would NOT make a point of marking someone publicly or in conversation. But this congregation seems to be overly concerned about sticking their noses up others behinds than to read what the Society has written. Power plays and people pleasing is what it seems to me.
  I don't agree with all this stuff, but as far as I know this "process" of marking hasn't changed over the last number of years, and again should only concern you and the ones you personally and quietly mark.
  However, years and years ago the marking was different; it was more like the disfellowshipping and only for the ones who were not baptized. (More control.) But that was changed ages ago to the above described. Maybe the Elders in this congregation need to get with the present and update their books! Not that I agree with the practice of shunning in any form but if you are going to do it, do it according to the rules for pete's sake!

  Lindy
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  ashitaka

  Hell, my wife and I are maked...it happens.

  ashi
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  HadEnuf

  Yes, I am sad to say that marking is alive and well here in the United States. My son was "marked" the week before his wedding a couple of years ago because he was marrying an unbaptized publisher (who, by the way, had grown up in the "truth" and had been seeking baptism for quite a while before she even met my son...but she wasn't in the right clique and she had been put off several times when she wanted to go over The Questions.) He was never even warned about this situation...most of the elders had congratulated him and were interested in the wedding arrangements. They had known my son since he was born and he was, and is, a wonderful, warm, caring person. But I guess our CO got wind of the wedding and pressured them to "mark" him. Quite a shock coming just two days before the wedding! So the wedding was boycotted by all the elders and wives and ministerial servants...they were actually told that if they attended they would "possibly" lose their "privileges".

  Anyway...though some would be somewhat friendly to them outside of the congregation...none of the elder's or ms's ever invited them over for a meal or any association. Few elder's would even converse with them at the meetings. Needless to say...they have since stopped attending meetings as have myself and my husband and younger son and her immediate family. (How do YOU spell RELIEF? NO MEETINGS)

  The whole marking and shunning thing is the most un-Christian thing the JW's do and is so totally unlike what Christ would do. It is almost unbelievable that people can even support such an arrangement. I did it for over 40 years and I am most ashamed of my unloving behavior.

  Marking is not rare at all. It is just a form of organized cruelty.
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  gambler

  The most common way to get marked is to marry an unbeliver.But in my congo a couple was marked for having a messy house, they were later disfelowshiped.The hallmark of how unloving they are.
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  ISP

  I've not come across this for a while. It usually follows a talk. But I don't see why it should take place. If someone has done something wrong, they usually get reproved. That should be the end of it.

  ISP
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  Celtic

  Hi the pair of you, Liane, not seen you in absolute yonks, you doing ok?

  Certainly going back a bit in the Falmouth Congregation, back even just before Liane came to Falmouth, there was quite a bit of marking going on in the congregation, as far as I'm aware, at least 6 or so of my friends were marked out in this manner from very young, it was like growing up with a curse painted on your back.

  peace

  celtic
  land of pagans and where things go bump in the night and Bro Leonard guffaws with uncontrollable laughter
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  cornish

  Hi there Missie Effe,
  I take it you are in the Falmouth congregation,I used to attend the St.Austell East cong but I went to Falmouth cong in Penryn on many occasions as my sister Julia James lives down there with her hubby Robert James,I keep saying this but sometimes it sure is a small world,funny thing I know a chap here in St.Austell who is now going out with a girl in a family I have known for years(not witnesses)who also went to Falmouth congegation.
  But this marking thing was always so mis used,its another tool to remind people to keep in line and some witnesses use it just because they dont like you much anyway,so unlike the illustration of the progidal son.
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  Wounded Heart

  hi missie eff,

  this definitely happens other places. when i was very young (im 34 now), i remember well, the elders saying from the platform so and so was "marked" and as someone mentioned, it was the equivalent to being DFd . when i was about 18-19, one day "A" and i were discussing "M" who was a newer friend of ours. "A" said "no, i dont want to invite her cause shes marked". i asked why "A" hadnt bothered to tell me (guess i missed that talk or daydreamed thru it). "A's" response was that "we arent supposed to talk about it". it seems that "M" was involved and going to marry a "worldly" (in every sense of the word) guy and thus had been marked. this was when it was up to each individual person to mark others as they saw fit. i never could figure out who was "in trouble", UNLESS i saw them headed into the "fishbowl" (library).

  ISP: i wonder if marking is different because the person is continuing with their plan of "wrongdoing". cause those that were marked (that i knew of) continued to do what they wanted to do (such as above mentioned "M" getting married to the "worldly" guy). were as being reproved is when you are repentant of something but they still have to "smack" ya in public. does this make sense to anyone but me? LOL.

  whatever the elders did publically (negatively) was purely wrong. WWJD? he certainly would not have treated ones who erred in the manner that elders/borg does these days.

  Kat
  Wounded Heart

  Love by giving to & accepting others unconditionally = true, pure love

  "When in doubt, do the loving thing." ~ 8yr old "Pirate"
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  thinkers wife

  I think Lindy is correct on the Book explanation. But as others have mentioned, it seems to be done differently in different congregations according to the elder's opinion.
  I was marked albeit unofficially. I'll tell the story since I find it amusing.
  We were finished with field service one day and I had been in a car group with two young boys fleshly brothers. Well they saw a frog and were afraid to pick it up. So being the wild and crazy woman I am, I picked it up. It promptly proceeded to pee in my hand. The word just popped out of my mouth. I said, "Oh shit". Several days later I heard through the formidable grapevine that I had been marked.
  Usually though I believe there is a talk given specifically discussing the wrongdoing and people are left in no doubt as to who and what it involves.
  The whole process is ridiculous IMO. And is just exactly what HadEnuf said, an organized form of cruelty. Her son's case is a case in point. How ridiculous. And how heartbreaking for all involved, and from the sounds of it totally uncalled for.
  TW