Does Wearing Your Nations Uniform Automatically Ensure a High Moral Ground?

by hillary_step 45 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  hillary_step

  Hillbilly,

  You tell me ...how may SDA, Weather Underground, Black Panthers or individuals who esposed those ideologies do you know who lived through the 70's or didnt end up in the button down world?

  I have no idea. I do know that many of the above died in 'action', or served long prison sentences. I would also suggest that many of these groups did play a part in bringing to the public forum knowledge of a segment of society previously swept under the carpet, albeit in an anti social manner. If you were alive then, you will remember what huge strides were made in civil rights by some very unpopular people.

  I introduced the Vietnam war, not to indulge you a trip down memory lane, but to illustrate just how easy it is for a small group of men to wage a pointless war and how many saw this at the time and refused to fight. They were not allowed any moral ground at the time, that being granted as usual, to those who wore the uniforms. The same thing is happening in Iraq, and will probably happen again in twenty years time.

  I am more interested in the pyschology of tribal commitment and how it becomes attached to moral issues.

  HS
• 

  WTWizard

  It should not--and neither should any other label or badge. When people expect more out of someone merely because of a label, they are really saying that such people need to be putting in everything and getting nothing out of society--while accepting all manner of abuse. And that is not moral.

  In truth, everyone should be striving to do what is good for themselves and for society. If everyone did that, the result would be that everyone would be better off, whether or not they are wearing any kind of badge or label. Not to mention there would be fewer people wearing the national uniform that are creating restrictions that are holding back the whole of civilization (which is the top form of immorality, since it is extremely bad for society and eventually for self).
• 

  hillary_step

  Stilla,

  YOU ARE OF COURSE CORRECT HS - but there is fuckall you and I can do about it.

  You know that I am an idealist, so sod off.

  HS
• 

  wings

  forgive me HS for simplifying this....but, if we really understand the causes of the issue, and take time to realize the travesty of it all. Then we must see that the entire system is victim to it's self, and the men in uniform are just a part of it. Why would we either condone or villainize them?

  Not wanting to take away their honor...but, no reason to not respect the absolution they have given. You said...some wars are with purpose....so the military has to function, in spite of the corrupt dysfunction of the government.

  Just a point...think about the non-draft situation...the recruiting is some serious marketing in society...these are the ones we are mostly talking about. Are they victims? Are they heros?

  wings
• 

  JK666

  They are heroes, and can be villainized by "moralistic" people. They deserve respect, as they are just doing their job, and are dignified in their duty. I lean Democrat, and I respect them fully.

  JK
• 

  Fadeout

  That's a new one for me... judging soldiers for doing their job and answering the call from their country.

  Wait... it's not new at all, I heard that in the Watchtower.

  Just so we're clear, we're not talking about soldiers being ordered to round up Jews and exterminate them... we're talking about soldiers being ordered to neutralize enemies who want to destroy America, right?
• 

  Warlock

  No.

  Warlock
• 

  restrangled

  Why do many of us, and this from all nations, feel that once a person dons a uniform and survives boot camp they are somehow automatically granted a morally superior position in society? Governments make mistakes, often huge mistakes, that should preclude this automatic assumption.

  Most citizens are able to easily distinguish the difference between the role of soldiers and the role of the government. By the end of the Vietnam War this nations military was in tatters....and often mocked by a lot of people who claimed moral high ground simply because they didn't wear a uniform. Old habits die hard for some. The younger generation is probably a little more astute than the geezers that would lump an individuals "service to country" and a nation's foreign policy together....which may explain why Americans as a whole whether Democrat or Republican recognize the sacrifice and service to country of both the soldier and their family.

  R's Hubby
• 

  sass_my_frass

  As usual I'm confused. I try to avoid these discussions, partly because I work for a very relevant government agency and partly because my opinion remains diametric to it, and it's best not to mention it. But since you asked... there are things about the military that I don't get. Firstly; how they keep getting away with the theft of the future of so many people who have such promise, just on the ludicrous apparitions of 'duty' and 'honour'. Secondly, that when these kids have been trained up and properly canned they think that at some point they'll get to have a say in what battles they're going to fight; that for a long time they think it's a democracy. Thirdly, that they think that everybody is grateful for their sacrifice and buys the same WMD bologna, or at least doesn't realise that outside the service, people can think whatever they damn please.

  Just my opinion.
• 

  nvrgnbk

  No.

  But it could get them killed before their twentieth birthday.