All they will do is make him feel bad--they might be trying to use him to get info on YOU! I went thru this when my son was underage and the sneaks would try to talk to him at his job!
Son sends "apostate" text message - Now the elders want to talk to him!!
by GoingGoingGone 48 Replies latest jw experiences
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sass_my_frass
Hmm, my opinion (short version): let him choose himself. Don't sell the idea and don't discourage it. He's the age where there are going to be growing pains with dad whatever happens. It's time for him to speak for himself on the things he cares about. If he cares about this, it would be good for him to say so. If he doesn't, good on him too.
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GoingGoingGone
Ok here's the latest.
I talked to my son last night when he got home. I told him that I really didn't think that there was any point in his meeting with the elders this time. More likely than not, their goal is to make him stop speaking his mind, using whatever means they have at their disposal.
He agreed. He decided to tell his dad that he's changed his mind and does not want to talk to those 2 elders, but that he could talk to the PO if he must speak to someone (he's spoken to the PO before and knows him well.)
Then today, as his dad is headed out the door to the meeting he says, "So then I'll tell brothers X and Y that you can meet with them on Monday night." And feeling that he hasn't had time to explain himself to his dad, my son says ok.
So I still don't know what's happening. The thing is, I don't think my son cares one way or the other about meeting with them. He knows it's a load of crap and isn't afraid to tell them so. I just don't think that he fully realizes the depths to which some elders will sink to make people do what they want.
I'm going to talk to him again in the morning and see what he really wants to do. If he does go, I'm going to tell him NOT to put up with any bullying, that he should go in there with a respectful tone and expect to be treated respectfully in return. If he is not, or feels threatened or belittled or anything of the kind, he should leave immediately. Honestly, I'd rather that he just didn't go at this point. Avoid them, cancel at the last minute, etc.
I'll keep you informed on what happens! And thanks again for the support.
GGG -
cognizant dissident
If it were my son, at 17, I would insist on being present at the meeting. Even though he is intelligent and knows his own mind, emotionally, he may not be any match for a couple of bullying elders and their judging, shaming tactics they often try and use to manipulate and silence independent thinkers. If you don't like the way the meeting is heading, then end it.
The fact that your son agreed to the meeting even after he told you he didn't want to do it, shows he is susceptible to pressure. Have you considered stepping in on his behalf and telling his father that he does not really want the meeting and you support and encourage his right not to attend it 100%?
Cog
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AudeSapere
boyzone wrote: If thats the case, if he goes into the meeting armed with WT quotes, or if he refuses to meet altogether, the end result will likely be the same, he'll be marked as a bad associate. How would you all feel about that?
He's already marked. It may not be congregational marking, but the friend and then the 2 elders have already marked him and you can be sure word has spread. Heck! Look how quick they spread the word about Obama & Hillary putting an end to religion.
Personally, I don't think the marking is the big deal here. The bigger deal is what effect the pressure from the elders will have on the father and son relationship. Because the son is so outspoken and is indeed going to college, the father will likely be encouraged to start withdrawing emotional and financial support.
THAT will be a horrible, crying shame.
-Aude.
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wha happened?
marking whether it's formal or informal is a powerful tool. It was used against me. And it caused me alot of harm.
Anything that prevents this boy from a proper amount of support for his education is nothing less than a crime -
GoingGoingGone
cog: "The fact that your son agreed to the meeting even after he told you he didn't want to do it, shows he is susceptible to pressure."
I agree - but I think he is most susceptible to pressure from his dad. He'll bend a little to keep his dad happy. But he doesn't really care what the JWs think.
"Have you considered stepping in on his behalf and telling his father that he does not really want the meeting and you support and encourage his right not to attend it 100%?"
That's one reason I'm going to talk to my son again, to find out what he really wants. He knows I will stick up for him if he needs me to.
AudeSapere: "The bigger deal is what effect the pressure from the elders will have on the father and son relationship. Because the son is so outspoken and is indeed going to college, the father will likely be encouraged to start withdrawing emotional and financial support."
The father-son relationship is what I'm most concerned with as well. They love each other, and I will NOT let the WTS interfere with that if I have anything to say about it. As far as withdrawing emotional and financial support, that is very unlikely.
As far as 'marking'... my son has mostly worldly friends now anyway. He has one friend he misses a lot, but it's not this guy.
GGG -
Will Power
(((GGG))) sorry I've been so out-of-touch for so long. another story. Whether to meet or not is a tough one. I agree with all the "don't bother" advice, for the sake of the whole family, but also with your son's need to express HIS INFORMED CHOICE. It's amazing how JWs go all the way to supreme court to defend their right to exercise their conscience - even to the point of PHYSICAL DEATH. Now these elders are in charge of your son's spiritual death. How dare play god! I'd love to hear a conversation where the entire JW practiced blood defence is used with word changes. Instead of blood, using lies and coverups as what is detestable to god - or any of the other unchristian characteristic JWs are famous for. I hope things go OK - remember, whatever happens - your husband will see the true colours of elders when faced with org policies over loving-christian principles. This may be his eye-opener - the final straw. wp
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Scully
Your son does not need to answer to the elders.
He needs to block that JW brat from sending him text messages, though.
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Quandry
I would really think hard about letting my child get in a room with two or three men whose intent you do not know.
What they may intend to do is use the meeting to drive a wedge between your son and his father. They may delve into education, and begin to work on dad, explaining why he should not allow his son to go to college, how it would be detrimental to his standing in the congregation.
I speak from personal experience with my child. You just never know what can happen in that back room. They will stoop to any level. They can be bullies. They can manipulate. They can lie. They can use any "theocratic tactic" they choose.
Your son is full of confidence and has a bright future. Please do not let these men drag him down, humiliate him, and cause divisions in your family!!!