Elders supposed contact DF&DA once every year???!!!??? (page 4)

Quandry

My daughter had just turned seventeen by maybe one day when they df'd her. She is almost twenty-one now.

Never has anyone called or come by to ask if she is alive or dead.

My blood pressure is up.........

one time... ONE time in 3+ years, there was a lame-@ss
effort to make a shepherding call....

my response was " if all you are going to do
is tell us to study the "family happiness" book, no thanks"

last time any elder has made an approach....

i, too, have a huge issue about my daughter's
baptism (at 11, her choice sompletely as i
never pressured her to do same).....

it was determined some 3-4 yrs after the fact
that she had multiple mental health diagnoses
and at the time of the actual baptism, she was
ineligible due to mitigating circumstances of conduct.....

at any rate, the elders are long since aware
of those issues as well as knowing she had
lived with a former b/f for the better part of a year

i am HOPING one of the wankers will man up
and show up, at which time i will inform them
that once they have nullified that baptism
they can contact me to make an appt

for which i will mightily prepare!!!

wha happened?

No one knocks on my door, although I've insulated myself pretty well.

tijkmo

***

w914/15ImitateGod’sMercyToday***

Imitate
God’sMercyToday
"Let us fall, please, into the hand of Jehovah, for many are his mercies."—2 SAMUEL 24:14.
KING DAVID knew from experience that Jehovah is more merciful than humans are. Confident that God’s ways, or paths, are best, David desired to learn His ways and to walk in His truth. (1 Chronicles 21:13; Psalm 25:4, 5) Do you feel as David did?

2
The Bible offers us insight into God’s thinking, even on such matters as what we should do if someone sins against us. Jesus told his apostles, who would later be Christian overseers: "If your brother commits a sin, go lay bare his fault between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother." The wrong involved here was not a mere personal slight but a serious sin, such as fraud or slander. Jesus said that if this step does not resolve the matter and if witnesses are available, the one sinned against should take them along to prove that there was a wrong. Is this the step of last resort? No. "If [the sinner] does not listen to them, speak to the congregation. If he does not listen even to the congregation, lethimbetoyoujustasamanofthenationsandasataxcollector."—Matthew 18:15-17.
3
Being Jews, the apostles would understand what it meant to treat a sinner "as a man of the nations and as a tax collector." Jews avoided association with people of the nations, and they despised Jews who worked as Roman tax collectors. (John 4:9; Acts 10:28) Hence, Jesus was advising the disciples that if the congregation rejected a sinner, they were to cease associating with him. How, though, does that harmonize with Jesus’ being with tax collectors at times?
4
Luke 15:1 says: "All the tax collectors and the sinners keptdrawingneartohimtohearhim." Not every tax collector or sinner was there, but "all" in the sense of many. (Compare Luke 4:40.) Which ones? Those who were interested in having their sins forgiven. Some such were earlier drawn to John the Baptizer’s message of repentance. (Luke 3:12; 7:29) So when others came to Jesus, his preaching to them did not violate his counsel at Matthew 18:17. Observe that "many tax collectors and sinners [heard Jesus] and they began followinghim." (Mark 2:15) These were not ones who wished to continue in a bad way of life, refusing any help. Rather, they heard Jesus’ message and their hearts were touched. Even if they were still sinning, though likely trying to make changes, "the fine shepherd" by his preaching to them was imitating his merciful Father.—John 10:14.
Forgiveness,
aChristianObligation

5
We have these warm assurances of our Father’s willingness to forgive: "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous so as to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness." "I am writing you these things that you may not commit a sin. And yet, if anyone does commit a sin, we have a helper with the Father, Jesus Christ, a righteous one." (1 John 1:9; 2:1) Is forgiveness possible for a disfellowshipped person?
6
Yes. At the time of disfellowshipping someone for unrepentant sin, elders who represent the congregation explain to him that it is possible for him to repent and receive God’s forgiveness. He may attend meetings at the Kingdom Hall, where he can hear Bible instruction that may help him to repent. (Compare 1 Corinthians 14:23-25.) In time he may seek reinstatement in the clean congregation. When elders then meet with him, they will try to determine whether he has repented and left his sinful course. (Matthew 18:18) If that is the case, he may be reinstated, in line with the pattern at 2 Corinthians 2:5-8. In the event that he had been disfellowshipped for many years, he will need to make a concerted effort to progress. He may also need considerable help thereafter to build up his Bible knowledge and appreciation so that he becomes a spiritually strong Christian.
Returning
toJehovah

7
But may the elders themselves take any initiative in approaching a disfellowshipped person? Yes. The Bible shows that mercy is expressed not simply by a negative holding back of punishment but often by positive acts. We have Jehovah’s example. Before he sent his unfaithful people into exile, he prophetically held out the prospect of their returning: "Remember these things, O Jacob, and you, O Israel, because you are my servant. . . . I will wipe out your transgressions just as with a cloud, and your sins just as with a cloud mass. Doreturntome, for I will repurchase you."—Isaiah 44:21, 22.
8
Then, during the exile, Jehovah took further steps, acting in a positive way. He sent prophets, his representatives, to invite Israel to ‘seek him and find him.’ (Jeremiah 29:1, 10-14) At Ezekiel 34:16, he likened himself to a shepherd and the people of the nation of Israel to lost sheep: "The lost one I shallsearchfor, and the dispersed one I shall bring back." At Jeremiah 31:10, Jehovah also used the imagery of his being a shepherd of the Israelites. No, he did not depict himself as a shepherd at the sheepfold waiting for the lost one to come back; rather, he showed himself as a shepherd searching for the lost ones. Note that even while the people in general were unrepentant and exiled, God initiated efforts to seek their return. And in line with Malachi 3:6, God would not change his way of dealing in the Christian arrangement.
9
Does this not suggest that there could be a reason for initiating steps toward some who are disfellowshipped and who may now be repentant? Remember that the apostle Paul gave direction to remove the wicked man from the Corinthian congregation. Later he exhorted the congregation to confirm their love toward the man because of his repentance, leading to his subsequent reinstatement in the congregation.—1 Corinthians 5:9-13; 2 Corinthians 2:5-11.
10
The encyclopedia quoted earlier said: ‘The basic rationale for excommunication was to protect the standards of the group: "a little leaven leavens the whole lump" (1 Cor. 5:6). This motive is clear in most biblical and extracanonical passages, but concernfortheindividual,evenafterexpulsion,wasthebasisofPaul’spleain2 Cor.2:7-10.’ (Italics ours.) Hence, concern of this kind should logically be shown today by the shepherds of the flock. (Acts 20:28; 1 Peter 5:2) Former friends and relatives might hope that a disfellowshipped one would return; yet out of respect for the command at 1 Corinthians 5:11, they do not associate with an expelled person. They leave it to the appointed shepherds to take the initiative to see if such a one is interested in returning.
11
It would not be fitting even for elders to take the initiative toward certain expelled ones, such as apostates, who ‘speak twisted things to draw away the disciples after themselves.’ These are ‘false teachers who are trying to bring in destructive sects and to exploit the congregation with counterfeit words.’ (Acts 20:30; 2 Peter 2:1, 3) The Bible also does not provide any basis for searching out disfellowshipped ones who are belligerent or who actively encourage wrongdoing.—2 Thessalonians 2:3; 1 Timothy 4:1; 2 John 9-11; Jude 4, 11.
12
However, many expelled ones are not like that. One may have ceased the serious wrongdoing for which he was disfellowshipped. Another may have been using tobacco, or he may in the past have been overdrinking, but he is not now trying to lead others into wrongdoing. Recall that even before exiled Israel turned to God, he sent representatives urging them to come back. Whether Paul or the elders in the Corinth congregation took some initiative to check on the disfellowshipped man, the Bible does not say. When that man had repented and ended his immorality, Paul directed the congregation to reinstate him.
13
In recent times there have been cases in which an elder happened to meet a disfellowshipped person. Where appropriate, the shepherd briefly outlined the steps to be taken for reinstatement. Some persons like this repented and were reinstated. Such joyful outcomes indicate that there may be disfellowshipped or disassociated ones who would respond to a merciful approach made by the shepherds. But how might the elders handle this matter? Once a year at most, the body of elders should consider whether there are such persons living in their territory. The elders would focus on those who have been expelled for over a year. According to the circumstances, if it is appropriate, they would assign two elders (hopefully ones familiar with the situation) to visit such an individual. No visit would be made on any who evidence a critical, dangerous attitude orwhohavemadeitknownthattheywantnohelp.—Romans 16:17, 18; 1 Timothy 1:20; 2 Timothy 2:16-18.
14
The two shepherds could telephone to ask about making a brief visit, or they could stop by at a suitable time. During the visit, they need not be stern or even cool but should warmly reflect their merciful concern. Instead of reviewing the past case, they could discuss Bible texts such as Isaiah 1:18 and 55:6, 7 and James 5:20. If the person is interested in returning to God’s flock, they could kindly explain what steps he should take, such as reading the Bible and publications of the Watch Tower Society and attending meetings at the Kingdom Hall.
15
These elders will need wisdom and discernment to determine whether there is indication of repentance and whether a follow-up visit would be advisable. They should bear in mind, of course, that some disfellowshipped persons will never be ‘revived to repentance.’ (Hebrews 6:4-6; 2 Peter 2:20-22) After the visit, the two would give a brief oral report to the Congregation Service Committee. They, in turn, would inform the body of elders at their next meeting. The elders’ merciful initiative will have reflected God’s view: "‘Return to me, and I will return to you,’ Jehovah of armies has said."—Malachi 3:7.
Other
MercifulHelp

16
What of those of us who are not overseers and will not be taking such initiatives toward disfellowshipped persons? What can we do consistent with this arrangement and in imitation of Jehovah?
17
As long as someone is disfellowshipped or disassociated, we need to follow the instruction: "Quit mixing in company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person or an idolater or a reviler or a drunkard or an extortioner, not even eating with such a man." (1 Corinthians 5:11) But this Biblical directive should not affect our view of Christian family members who live with the disfellowshipped person. Ancient Jews reacted so strongly to tax collectors that their hatred was extended even to the family of the tax collector. Jesus did not endorse that. He said that a sinner who refused help was to be treated "just as a man of the nations and as a tax collector"; he did not say that Christian family members were to be so treated.—Matthew 18:17.
18
We ought to be especially supportive of the family members who are faithful Christians. They may already face pain and obstacles because of living at home with an expelled person who may actually discourage their spiritual pursuits. He may prefer not to have Christians visit the home; or if they do come to see the loyal family members, he may not have the courtesy to keep away from the visitors. He may also impede the family’s efforts to go to all Christian meetings and assemblies. (Compare Matthew 23:13.) Christians thus disadvantaged truly deserve our mercy.—2 Corinthians 1:3, 4.
19
One way we can show tender mercy is by ‘speaking consolingly’ and having encouraging conversations with such faithful ones in the household. (1 Thessalonians 5:14) There are also fine opportunities to give support before and after meetings, while in field service, or when together at other times. We need not mention disfellowshipping but can discuss many upbuilding things. (Proverbs 25:11; Colossians 1:2-4) While the elders will continue to shepherd the Christians in the family, we might find that we too can visit without having dealings with the expelled person. If the disfellowshipped one happens to answer when we visit or telephone, we can simply ask for the Christian relative that we are seeking. Sometimes the Christian family members may be able to accept an invitation to our home for association. The point is: They—young and old—are our fellow servants, beloved members of God’s congregation, not to be isolated.—Psalm 10:14.
20
Another area for showing mercy opens when an expelled one is reinstated. Jesus’ illustrations highlight the joy in heaven when ‘one sinner repents.’ (Luke 15:7, 10) Paul wrote to the Corinthians regarding the man that had been disfellowshipped: "You should kindly forgive and comfort him, that somehow such a man may not be swallowed up by his being overly sad. Therefore I exhort you to confirm your love for him." (2 Corinthians 2:7, 8) Let us apply that advice soberly and lovingly in the days and weeks after a person is reinstated.
21
Jesus’ illustration of the prodigal son brings up a danger that we need to avoid. The older brother did not rejoice at the prodigal’s return but was resentful. May we not be like that, harboring ill will over a past wrong or begrudging a person’s being reinstated. Rather, our goal is to be like the father, who illustrated Jehovah’s response. The father was happy that his son, who was lost and seemed as good as dead, was found, or came to life. (Luke 15:25-32) Accordingly, we will freely speak to the reinstated brother and otherwise encourage him. Yes, we should make it evident that we are showing mercy, as our forgiving and merciful heavenly Father does.—Matthew 5:7.
22
There is no question that if we want to imitate our God, we must show mercy in harmony with his commands and his justice. The psalmist describes him this way: "Jehovah is gracious and merciful, slow to anger and great in loving-kindness. Jehovah is good to all, and his mercies are over all his works." (Psalm 145:8, 9) What a loving pattern for Christians to copy!
[Footnotes]
"Tax collectors were especially despised by the Jewish population of Palestine for several reasons: (1) they collected money for the foreign power that occupied the land of Israel, thus indirectly giving support to this outrage; (2) they were notoriously unscrupulous, growing wealthy at the expense of others of their own people; and (3) their work involved them in regular contact with Gentiles, rendering them ritually unclean. Contempt for tax collectors is found both in the N[ew] T[estament] and the rabbinic literature . . . According to the latter, hatred was to be extended even to the family of the tax collector."—TheInternationalStandardBibleEncyclopedia.
If in a Christian’s household there is a disfellowshipped relative, that one would still be part of the normal, day-to-day household dealings and activities. This could include being present when spiritual material is considered as a family.—See TheWatchtower of November 15, 1988, pages 19-20.
See 1991YearbookofJehovah’sWitnesses, pages 53-4.
If any Witness, in the house-to-house preaching or in another way, learns of a disfellowshipped person living in the territory, he should give that information to the elders.

tijkmo

as an elder i was really excited when this was announced...

but the general attitude of the body that i was then attached to was...oh great more work for us...why should we show mercy to scum.

as a result not much effort was put forward to find df-ed ones.

more often than not reasons for not calling were looked for.

i did get a call when i was df-ed but then i was attending all the meetings. as wth all elders there are those who care and there are those who dont.

when i was reinstated i wrote to the gb with my thoughts on the 'once a year' arrangement and how it was generally treated by the bodies of elders that i had served with.

the gb would definately fall into the 'dont care' category.

but i dont suppose any of them have actually done any searching

Confession

By very early 2006, my mother had questioned my former congregation to find out if anyone had requested my "publisher card." She was informed they hadn't, which meant I wasn't attending meetings.
This really pisses me off. Why would your Publisher Record Cards™ be any of your mother's business? There ought to be some confidentiality. When I moved to a different province, the local Elders™ never bothered to request my Publisher Record Card™, they just started a brand new one. The CO vouched for me because he knew me and my family from the old congregation and he had just been assigned to the Circuit™ to where I'd moved. Not protocol, but I'm sure I'm not the only one whose Publisher Record Card™ never got forwarded.

As you might imagine, I too felt heat beneath my collar, realizing that, at 40 years of age, Mommy had just phoned "the boys" to officially check up on me. I was told that the elder said to her, "Well I'm very sorry to tell you this, but...no one has requested his publisher card, so this must mean he is not attending meetings or trying to be part of a congregation in California." This is a lovely, little arrangement for keeping track of us. Can you say, "Masters Over Your Faith"? Bite me.

Honesty

She was certain that "the elders contact every DF & DA person ONCE PER YEAR to determine if their situation or attitude has changed."

I DA'd in NOVEMBER 2004.

The only elder who has contacted me since then was at the local strip mall.

He was 'out in Service' and saw me when he pulled into the next parking space.

"When are going to come back to the kingdom hall?"

That was it.

Especially after I told him about my conversion experience the night I accepted Jesus as my Lord and Savior and He sent the Holy Spirit to live in my heart.

That JW literally ran for the hills.

Alexia

My last meeting was in 2002. I was not DF or DA, I just left.

No calls, no letter – nothing.

Wasanelder Once

let's be honest, as some ex elders have said they wanted to show this form of "mercy". I was one of those too. It is fair to say that I knew who wanted nothing to do with the congregation any longer and so I didn't call on them if there were no sign of change in their actions or speech. Those of you who DA'd or are actively speaking against the congregation, what makes you think they are stupid enough to waste their time? It's hardly fair to complain that they are falling down on their job when they are respecting your wishes by not calling. It was meant more for people who were "caught up in sin" and had outgrown their evil ways. I never saw anyone respond that I or anyone else called on. After a while I too said, screw it. W.Once

kerj2leev

Those of you who DA'd or are actively speaking against the congregation, what makes you think they are stupid enough to waste their time? It's hardly fair to complain that they are falling down on their job when the are respecting your wishes by not calling.

No shit!

Stop bitching about not being called on.

Grow up and move on!!

Elders supposed contact DF&DA once every year???!!!???

Quandry

chickpea

wha happened?

tijkmo

tijkmo

Confession

Honesty

Alexia

Wasanelder Once

kerj2leev

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