Is baptism voided for those disassociated?

by sacolton 18 Replies latest jw friends

  • blondie
    blondie

    The development of the recently worded 1985 questions would then only apply to JWs baptized from that date. That is not the case with the WTS, they do not feel that members have to be rebaptized every time a change is made in doctrine or procedure. I have never heard a jw describe baptism as a contract with the WTS nor seen the WTS put that concept in writing in their publications.

    They base the need not to rebaptize on the account in 1 Corinthians where the erring Christian brother was not required to get rebaptized or that God had to re-select him as going to heaven.

    ***

    w76 3/1 pp. 158-159 Questions From Readers

    Can an anointed Christian who is disfellowshiped later be reinstated and still have the heavenly hope?

    Yes, that is possible. Of course, in each case Jehovah God is the one to determine whether he will extend forgiveness.

    The fact that this is possible is borne out by what we read in the apostle Paul’s letters to the Corinthian congregation. He wrote to Christians who had been anointed by holy spirit and given the hope of heavenly life. Paul addressed them as "you who have been sanctified in union with Christ Jesus, called to be holy ones."—1 Cor. 1:2; 15:49.

    One of these anointed Christians began to practice fornication. When he evidently did not repent and stop his immorality, Paul directed the congregation to disfellowship him. (1 Cor. 5:1-5, 9-13) However, it seems that this disfellowshiped person thereafter did sincerely repent. He is understood to be the person whom Paul was referring to in his second letter when he advised the Corinthians to forgive and accept back the former sinner.—2 Cor. 2:6-11; 7:8-13.

    When that man was reinstated into the congregation, what was his hope? Had he lost the heavenly calling, and had his hope now been changed to everlasting life on earth? No, for the earthly hope is not, as it were, a second-chance prospect. Abel, Enoch, Noah, Abraham and multitudes of other persons of outstanding faith had the hope of eternal life on earth, but this was not because they failed to measure up to the heavenly calling. They simply did not live in the time when the heavenly calling was in process according to Jehovah’s will. (Heb. 10:19, 20) Comparable faith and integrity are required of all who will gain everlasting life, whether in heaven or on a paradise earth. A Christian who is anointed with holy spirit and made a joint heir with Christ must prove faithful to that calling if he is to receive eternal life at all.—Rev. 2:10, 11; Phil. 3:8-14; Rom. 8:14-17.

    This, though, does not mean that while they are on earth anointed Christians never sin. In the flesh, they are still imperfect and consequently they sin, as do all humans, and may even commit gross sin. The Christian disciple and Bible writer James, certainly an anointed Christian, wrote: "For we all stumble many times. If anyone does not stumble in word, this one is a perfect man." (Jas. 3:2; 2:5) It appears that such unintentional sin resulting from imperfection is what the apostle John meant by "sin that does not incur death." (1 John 5:16) God can forgive such sins. John said: "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous so as to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."—1 John 1:9.

    But repentance is necessary. If an anointed Christian today practiced gross sin and did not manifest repentance, the congregation, out of obedience to God’s counsel, would have to disfellowship him. If he subsequently repented, though, he could be forgiven and reinstated, as was the man in Corinth.

  • sacolton
    sacolton

    Blondie, when the PO came to see me when I was having doubts, he said "during your baptism, you made an oath". So, when the announce to the congregation that I was no longer a Jehovah's Witness ... it seems to indicate that the baptism oath is broken.

  • blondie
    blondie

    Oath is not a contract in WTS language; they tend to call it a vow. In 50 years, I never had a jw tell me officially (or read in a WT publication) that someone's baptism was broken by being df'd or da'd or being inactive. There was always the concept that you could come back and be part of the "family" again if you were repentant and and turned away from the sin.

    *** w64 2/15 p. 125 Did You Make an Acceptable Dedication to God? ***However, because a person does not live up to his dedication, it does not mean that his dedication was invalid. What it does mean is that he is simply not living up to that dedication! It represents failure to fulfill his vow, his promise, and not a failure to make a correct dedication and baptism in the first place. How serious this is can be seen from God’s Word: "Whenever you vow a vow to God, do not hesitate to pay it, for there is no delight in the stupid ones. What you vow, pay."—Eccl. 5:4.
    *** w61 1/15 p. 38 Should Your Baby Be Baptized? ***The baptism of a Christian serves as a symbol that one has dedicated his life to God and has vowed, like Jesus: ‘I am come to do your will, O God.’
  • blondie
    blondie

    The thing to remember is the WTS makes the rules and they don't have to agree with the bible or any individual's interpretation.

  • Nathan Natas
    Nathan Natas

    Failing to fulfill a contract isn't the same as voiding (cancelling) one.

  • eyeslice
    eyeslice

    The Society is in the enviable position of constantly being able to make up new rules as they wish. What I can say is that in my 50 years in the 'truth' I never came across someone who got baptised a second time, though I do know of very many who were disfellowshipped or DA'ed who came back.

    Personally, my baptism vows were the old wording - so my baptism was not a case recognising myself as one of Jehovah's Witnesses, merely acknowledging myself as a sinner who would hence forth seek to do God's will. Seems to me that I could take that vow to almost any other religion!

  • Nathan Natas
    Nathan Natas

    Yes, eyeslice, you could, and back in Pastor Russell's day a baptism in any of Christendom's churches was deemed OK, because Russell thought he was gathering real Christians to God's organization; he didn't define other churches as being evil to the degree that rutherford later did, thus making JWs something new and unique.

  • WuzLovesDubs
    WuzLovesDubs

    If baptism is a contract, then if you disassociate you didnt void the contract, you BREACHED it, according to them, and they or GOD...dont have to uphold their part of the bargain any more. You didnt stick to the rules, so they dont have to let you into Paradise, nor do they have to treat you like a human being.

    When you buy a car, you sign a contract, if you stop paying because you dont like the color of it any more, you are still on the hook for it.

  • isaacaustin
    isaacaustin

    With the current announcement there is no distinction between df and da

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