by lurk3r 14 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
These ones who are in the organization that are "newly" annointed, it would seem they are kinda screwing things up for the GB and the society. Has anyone
heard of what "spiritual" experience these ones go through, to have them identify themselves as such? Do all the "144,00" go through similar experiences
as one another? Ever heard of one getting d/f'd?
lurk3r
"Has anyone heard of what 'spiritual' experience these ones go through, to have them identify themselves as such?"
I knew a member of the anointed who was in the post 1935 group. I kept egging him to give me an explanation as to what an anointed felt when he was anointed. He finally mentioned that he was in tune with certain things such as the earth rotating beneath his feet. That reminded me of when I was a (non JW) child and used to have the same fantasy.
Has anyone heard of what "spiritual" experience these ones go through, to have them identify themselves as such?
That is a good question.
What is JW stigmata? There should be something.
He finally mentioned that he was in tune with certain things such as the earth rotating beneath his feet.
I'm glad that the "anointed one" felt that he could feel the earth move on occasions!
I'm still puzzled as to what is going on with this "anointed" mechanism. It seems to be some kind of emotional experience not dissimilar to the "born again" feeling that some have. The fact that statistically numbers jump when the WTS "softens" their line (eg May 1 2007 WT QFR) and reduce when they tighten up shows that people are influenced by what they read - but that is just one factor.
And yes - I've known quite a few anointed to be df'd. And reinstated.
Well, according to the WTS spin on 1 Corinthians, that man was anointed and reinstated so they see no incongruity with anointed now being df'd and reinstated.
In many cases, "being anointed" simply translates in JW-talk the same kind of experience which other Christians call "conversion" or "being born again" -- something which easily happens when you start reading the NT for yourself and not as belonging to some special class...
Iow, to many JWs it is just one step away from "apostasy" (cf. Little Toe's experience which was brought bttt a few days ago). Whether or not the next step is made depends on one's psychology -- whether the "spiritual experience" stimulates one's critical mind or anesthesises it...
Here are some material I copied with experiences of anointment
It was a special spiritual experience. I was in the kitchen alone. All in may family were sleeping. I think I was praying or was it that I was meditating on spiritual matters. I had my eyes closed and it felt like I was lifted up from the floor. I did not open the eyes but I think I remained on the floor. Just a feeling of flying up to heaven to the presence of our heavenly Father. It felt like he was by my side behind me may be about 5 meters. There I was flouting in the space. At that moment or was it shortly afterward, I was like looking down on earth, on the green gras and treas and all got gray before my eyes. I felt like I lost my connection to the paradise hope. There I was looking down on earth and I felt that I am loosing my connection to earth. Then the vision stoped and I opened my eyes, and I was back on earth. I wanted to stay in that vision, or it to be repeated, but it haven't. But it was nice, I liked it. From that time on ward I started to expect that I'll be anointed. I did not understand that this was the anointing. But the desire to be in paradise disappeared. Then always hearing or reading about God's kingdom I unwillingly was paused in breathing and taking a deep breath. The more I doubted the more something squeezed my heart when I encountered scriptures concerning the anointed in my personal Bible reading. Just before the anointing I had read through all the Bible in about 3 months. Then I started to read it once again and where apostle Paul writes "we". Before I automatically made the conclusion that he refers to the anointed and not to me. But after my anointing, rereading these passages felt so familiar, like he is meaning me personally. So all this built up a confidence in me that the holy spirit is telling me that I have been adopted to be God's spiritual son. When I finaly got convinced, then almost all such testimonies of the holy spirit ceased. Propaply because I am already convinced and therefore there is not a need to convince me again. But these testimonies happened surely hundreds of times reading the Bible, because the matter is touched so often in the Bible.
Actually the Watchtower explains that the holy spirit affects the anointed in that way when they read scriptures that talk about them.
Next is of a brother who was in fulltime service for long times. In his life story he tells how he got anointed, it is a interesting and quite long story.
http://www.perimeno.ca/DoesGod.htm
The next article is written by a former Jehovah's witness missionary, who confesses to be anointed and he tells some experiences of other anointed.
http://members.shaw.ca/homechristian/docs/articles/FaithfulandDiscreetSlave.htm
8. The calling of each one seems to be radically different, one from another. Several people, some personally known by me, have had unique experiences which can best be described as the ‘promptings’ of God’s holy spirit. Two of these were on the verge of suicide, but after they prayed, (in both cases) they sensed an inner peace, a reassuring calmness that came over them. On the following day, they (each, separately) had the unexpected visit of a Christian to encourage them, and to study the Bible with them. Another unique example is that of a young man who had just returned from the military. He was not a Christian, but out of curiosity he went (with some of his friends) to a ‘Billy Graham’ Crusade. On his way to the platform, God’s divine plan of salvation "flashed before his eyes." None of his friends shared this experience. It was unique to him. Some time later, he got a Bible and began to read it, but could not understand what he was reading. And so he prayed about it. Shortly thereafter, he came across a book, (Divine Plan of the Ages), by C. T. Russell, and to his great amazement and utter surprise, its contents were exactly what had "flashed before his eyes" a few years before.
Two other examples are of persons who had been Christians for many years. One day, each one felt touched by God’s holy spirit, and realized it meant a relationship with God, (i.e., son-ship).
Yet another example is that of my wife. As a young woman, she felt overwhelmed by life’s difficult experiences and regularly went to a nearby hill to meditate and pray. "One day, suddenly," she relates: "I felt surrounded by God’s love, reassuring me that he really cares for me." My own situation is that, from a very young lad, I have always felt very close to God. But when I understood what a relationship with him really meant, it was only then that my feelings of being God’s son were confirmed to me by his spirit.
Thaks for the replies all!
long and short of it all...if the numbers keep going up every year, as opposed to going down, it's going to be destructive. I am VERY interested, at the memorial this year to hear if "the number of partakers keeps going down" is brought out like it all the other years that i have been present. After all, the number going down, has always been an indicator that "soon there will be no more partakers and hence the end must actually BE HERE!". I wonder if it will be a noticebly absent (at least to some) point that doesn't support doctrine, the way it used too. Anyone here know what i mean? I get lost in my words all the time.
Nark. What you are saying, I have wondered the point you are making many times myself. Non Christian religions must have their own "form" of the Holy Spirit as well yes? Perhaps called something else. I am short on time to google, cut and paste, but have made mental notes of it before. I have an old relative that is one of the "annointed". I will note that he/she isn't a whack job, and it's because of this that I believe them. Growing up as a dub, it was just a given that they were one of the 144,00. In more recent past years, I have deduced that since he/she has a calling, perhaps she is still yet unaware of what EXACTLY that calling actually is, or entails. Does this make sense to you? I mean, one may have a "calling", but does anyone really know what it means...exactly? It's a spirit calling some apparently get and we reside here on earth...
lurk3r
lurk3r
I feel that no religion -- not even "religion" in general -- has a monopoly on what we call "spiritual experience" (for the lack of a better word, for the lack of any word in fact). When you read about or from the "mystics" (in Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, etc.) you will recognise (provided you are sensitive to it yourself) a common "tune" with many variations, which is basically wordless and turns around wordlessness itself. But of course as soon as it has to be expressed, thought, understood or theorised it will have to use the linguistical and cultural material available, which depends on where (in which group or socio-cultural settings) you happen to be. If I speak of "an experience with the limits of language and the language-constructed 'self'," for instance, I'm not expressing it better than anyone, I'm just using the language which is currently available to me. Others (or I, at some other point in my life) would say "I have been anointed," "I was born again," "I was baptised in Holy Spirit," "I met God or Jesus," "I was enlightened," "I see," "I felt Oneness," "I am," "I am the truth," "I am God," "I am everything" or "I am nothing". This poses a double problem imo. First the experiences tends to be highjacked to serve the agenda of one particular ideology, or of ideologies at odds with each other. Second, inasmuch as the experience is socially valued, expected and encouraged it tends to be faked. And even if it was genuine at some point it will hardly remain so in the repetition of so-called "testimony".
Sometimes I wonder if one positive aspect of JWism as I have known it was not (in a most paradoxical way) the "bad light" it cast on any "spiritual experience" or even emotion. You did not expect it, it surprises you, you have to face the perspective of alienation from the group for it (either being looked down upon as a "fruitcake," disregarded as "ambitious," or rejected as an "evil apostate"). Still, it happens, and when it does it tends to be (subjectively) real. Of course it can be faked too, but I would suspect less than in churches where emotional conversion is expected.
These ones who are in the organization that are "newly" annointed, it would seem they are kinda screwing things up for the GB and the society
Yep, sure are!!!
I remember some twenty five years ago witnesses were fond of saying "It is certain that we have the truth, because the number of annointed keeps going down each year. It is one of the marks of true religion."
I remember reading a quote on this forum from Fred Franz in one of his talks to Gilead, some twenty years or more ago, that ANYONE stating that they were of the annointed were a replacement, as he had insisted that the "closing date" for the calling of annointed ones was 1935.
Well, wonder what those same people have to say now? Many seem to be "jumping on the band wagon" and proclaiming they are annointed. Could they all be replacements? Those annointed must be a bad bunch if that's true.
