My Book of Bible Stories: Noah

Simon

Remember this?

The Noah let a black bird called a raven out of the ark. It woudl fly away for a while and then it would come back, because it could not find a good place to land. It kept doing this and each time it returned, it would rest on the ark.
Noah wanted to see if the waters had run off the earth, so next he sent a dove out of the ark. But the dove came back too because it did not find a place to stay. Noah sent it out a second time, and it brought back an olive leaf in it's beak. So Noah knewthat the waters had gone down. Noah sent out the dove a thrid time, and finally it found a dry place to live.
God now spoke to Noah. He said: "Go out of the ark. Take your whole family and the animals with you."

Far be it from me to pick any holes in Gods book but ...

Why the switch from raven to dove? Wasn't it trying hard enough?

How lucky was it coming back with an olive branch that just happens to now be (post flood) a native plant to that area. Why not an Oak branch?

Just because it didn't come back the third time it doesn't follow that it had found a dry pace to live - it could have been floating upside down after getting lost and not making it back and was being eaten by sharks. Maybe it had got so fed up with the 'smell of shit' on the ark that it couldn't face going back and decided to end it all.

Why all this piddling about with birds anyway? Why not just look out of the damn ark! If it's dry where you are then you come out and don't need to send a dove out to know that. If it isn't dry then so what if the dove did find somewhere - can you fly? NO! So stay in the damn ark!

What are the chances of the other doves finding that one to mate? Weren't some doves sacrificed as well? Why do we still have them?

Did Noah think god had pulled a big plug out somewhere? Where was the water supposed to be going? (Maybe the drowning dove drank it all?)

What kind of idiot would make this stuff up, never mind believe it!

expatbrit

Ravens are big, black, ugly, lazy Satan worshippers. Doves are cute, peaceable Christians. Everyone knows this. It's obvious just by looking at 'em!

Isn't it amazing how the bible harmonises with known facts? Truly evidence of it's divine inspiration!

Expatbrit

Fredhall

Simon,

The bible doesn't mentioned all the things happened during the flood. God's give us information that is important for us.

blondie

Well, here's an "answer" from a QFR:

*** w92 1/15 31 Questions From Readers ***
Why did Noah send out from the ark a raven and then a dove?

The Bible does not give a detailed explanation. However, there does seem to be logic in Noah’s course.

For 40 days and 40 nights, the earth experienced an overwhelming rainfall, causing a deluge that covered even the tops of the mountains for five months. Then “the ark came to rest on the mountains of Ararat.” (Genesis 7:6–8:4) Months later, after “the tops of the mountains appeared,” Noah “sent out a raven, and it continued flying outdoors, going and returning.”—Genesis 8:5, 7.

Why a raven? This bird is a strong flier, and it can subsist on a wide range of food items, including dead flesh. Noah may have sent out the raven to see whether it would return or would stay away from the ark, perhaps eating from the remnants of carcasses exposed as the waters receded and land appeared. However, the raven did not stay away. The Bible says that it returned, but it does not say that it returned to Noah. Perhaps it came back to rest on the ark between flights to find food floating on the still-prevailing waters.

Later, Noah chose to send out a dove. We read: “The dove did not find any resting-place for the sole of its foot, and so it returned to him into the ark.” (Genesis 8:9) This suggests that in its own way, the dove could serve in determining whether the floodwaters had abated. Doves manifest considerable trust of humans. Noah could expect that the dove would return, not just to rest on the ark, but to Noah himself.

It is said that doves rest only on dry ground, are known to fly low in valleys, and feed on vegetation. (Ezekiel 7:16) Grzimek’s Animal Life Encyclopedia notes: “As is true of all pigeons and doves eating seeds and nuts, there is difficulty in feeding when snow [or water] cover persists more than a day, most of their potential food being on the ground surface.” So the dove might bring back to Noah some evidence that it had found dry ground or sprouting plants. The first time that Noah sent it out, the dove simply returned to him in the ark. The second time, the dove came back with an olive leaf. The third time, it did not return, giving evidence that it was possible and safe for Noah to leave the ark.—Genesis 8:8-12.

While some might consider these to be incidental details, the fact that the account is so specific, without any straining to give complete explanations, reflects the Bible’s credibility. It gives us additional reason to accept the account to be, not contrived or fabricated, but honestly accurate. The lack of exhaustive details and explanations also suggests what interesting things faithful Christians may look forward to asking Noah when he is resurrected and can explain firsthand the whys and wherefores of his actions.—Hebrews 11:7, 39."

Incidentally, I thought all the animals trusted humans until after the flood. I do know that the raven is considered unclean (carrion eater) and the dove is considered a clean animal (suitable for eating). Maybe Noah made a mistake by sending a raven and Jehovah corrected him.

Ravens fed Elijah (?) in the wilderness although ravens are considered unclean. The holy spirit appeared in the form of a dove.

radar

Simon
___________________________________________________________________
What kind of idiot would make this stuff up, never mind believe it!

____________________________________________________________________

Well considering most on this board once believed it, I guess we were that kind of idiot!

When I look back at how I used to teach this crazy story to my children, and then at that time, make fun of those that believed in Christmas, Its embarrasing.

Radar

Like all people who have nothing, I lived on dreams

Simon

Just noticed another thing on the same story (page 11)

The picture clearly shows the ark floating off with two wooley mammoths standing atop a hill in the pouring rain.

Noah didn't do a ver ygood job of taking two of every animal did he?

Farkel

: Why all this piddling about with birds anyway? Why not just look out of the damn ark! If it's dry where you are then you come out and don't need to send a dove out to know that. If it isn't dry then so what if the dove did find somewhere - can you fly? NO! So stay in the damn ark!

ROFLMAO, Simon!!

Noah was probably loaded each time he sent out those birds, or too blurry eyed to be able to see if any land was visible or not.

After all, the Bible tells us Noah was a drunk and a flasher.

Farkel

"I didn't mean what I meant."

ISP

The picture clearly shows the ark floating off with two wooley mammoths standing atop a hill in the pouring rain.
Noah didn't do a ver ygood job of taking two of every animal did he?

He didn't do a very good job. But there again would you want to muck out a pair of them!?

ISP

Thirdson

Many scholars believe the deluge story to be two different versions of the story that have been woven together to make one tale. There are lots of "doubles" in the account, from the way God is addressed to the number of animals. In one story Noah sent a raven and in the other a dove. In the Bible's combined version both a raven and dove are used.

However, in the story God tells Noah to leave. So why did he not have faith that God would let him know it was OK to leave the ark? Also, didn't the ark have windows and a decent view? Why did Noah risk the extintion of an entire species of bird by letting it out?

I guess we shouldn't criticize the story too much as we might not enjoy it so much. It's a bit like criticizing Star Trek which we all know is not scientific and is just fantasy.

Thirdson

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

blondie

Genesis 7:1-3 ***
2 Of every clean beast you must take to yourself by sevens, the sire and its mate; and of every beast that is not clean just two, the sire and its mate; 3 also of the flying creatures of the heavens by sevens, male and female, to preserve offspring alive on the surface of the entire earth.

Thirdson, that is correct. There would have only been 2 ravens to start with because they were unclean. We could speculate that the pair might have had young during the year Noah and his family were in the ark.

Also, the dove was considered clean and so Noah would have taken either 7 or 14 birds based on the scripture above. It would have been more sensible for Noah to have used a dove in the beginning unless the raven pair had had offspring.

All of this is assuming you believe the Bible account of the flood.

My Book of Bible Stories: Noah

Share this