by tresdecu 25 Replies latest jw friends
ATJ,
In theory all elders are supposed to go to the Patterson elders school eventually, although at the rate they're going (96 / week I believe) it will take at least a decade.
I still say the reason for doing the POs first was to scout out potential "pseudo-COs" for the switch from full time to part time COs....assuming of course the rumors are true.
Good thoughts on here. The CO arrangement was always the most irritating time of year for me. I wouldpurposely not go out in service during that week, just so it wouldn't look like I was trying to suck up to the CO like every other elder/MS was. Also, the visits were the same every single time. Same talks, same little "letters" he would read expressing how great it was to be back in our congregation... as if he wanted to make us feel like we were his favorite congo or something. Sickening. And every CO was the same--all nearly vacant of personality. No offense, but that's what it seemed like. Like they had no soul. No wonder, what with being such tools for the borg.
It reminds me of when Henschel split up the Watch Tower Corporations and separated the governing body from the Watch Tower Society. He resigned as Watch Tower president, but didn't resign as a member of the governing body. Which job has most power? How?
The governing body is not legally associated with the Watch Tower Corporations. They don't represent Jehovah's Witnesses and they don't represent the Watch Tower Corporation. That makes the governing body an unrelated third party. If there's a legal tie, I'd like to see it.
The Jehovah's Witness people are forth parties with no legal connections at all. The Watch Tower Corporation refuses them standing as members in any of the over 100 pyramid of corporations under the Pennsylvania corporation. Many of the western kingdom halls are incorporated locally but they refuse to welcome individual Jehovah's Witness people as members as well. If you don't believe me, try to get membership in one of the corporations. It can't be done.
Most circuit riders I knew were incompetent. It'd be easy for me to eliminate their jobs. They could just re-establish a version of the old service director position that Rutherford used to oust the Bible Student elders. Of course that will fail just as it did before and in 20 years they will bring back the traveling sales managers.
Gary, I don't think it was Henschel who split the GB from the WTS. That happened in 2000, and I just happened to be in Bethel when they announced this at the annual meeting. If I remember correctly, Henschel was pretty much on his death bed at the time. Anyway, just a minor point. It was a move pushed from legal more than anything.
The governing body is not legally associated with the Watch Tower Corporations. They don't represent Jehovah's Witnesses and they don't represent the Watch Tower Corporation. That makes the governing body an unrelated third party. If there's a legal tie, I'd like to see it.
Gary, I could be wrong on this, but on all of the property and legal documents prior to my leaving in 2006, there was always a clause that said that these "legal entities" (could be RBC, PA or NY Corp, individual KH's) were under the "control of the ecclesiastical Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses".
The term "ecclesiastical" anything is a legal term that allows for the religious leaders of a religion to appoint officers to the legal entities necessary to run their religion under US law. Ultimately, these officers serve at the pleasure of the legally recognized "ecclesiastical" religious leaders. That is the only reason why after Henschel died, the President was of the "other bah bah" class. When the GB found that legally, they could run the corps without having to be officers on them, they did that. This was started in the late 90's....
I am happy to be wrong about this, but I have seen this clause in more then one legal document that the borg uses....
daniel-p: Interesting! Who was the architect of the corporate split in 2000?
AllTimeJeff: Thanks Jeff, So that makes the governing body a clergy class:-)
Hmmm okay Winston .... you won't give out the jw org pass (neither would I) but is there a method to the WTS madness? Is zipcodes involved, WTS dates, are congregations given numerical codes?..... During your DCs do COs gossip about this rumor? I know mine has heard it because of his teasing comments.
Why don't you and BF get together and work out some sort of CO for dummies overview of yall's experiences being COs and training.
(Reminds me..... is Maximus still alive and if he is, how is he doing?........I loved his posts)
Very strange all around, considering all the strange changes they've been making the past few years.
Still sounds like they are practically disassembling the entire religion itself, one little step at a time.
#4 sounded like a biggie to me, that pioneers get the "OK" from the local elders vs. the Big Wigs in NY.
And opposite to many sentiments, I never met a CO I didn't like, lol... they were all quite a blast to hang out with (1980s):
Paul Moske and wife Peggy - he was the funniest of all the COs, she as so sweet
Hollis Milliken and wife (can't remember her first name, doggonit, hate when that happens) - they both were sweet, I liked them both.
Mickey Erskin (sp?) and wife Shirley - they were cool, too, especially Shirley, but together maybe they were more uptight than the others.
Favorite DO: Dave Thomas and wife, Trujean. I loved Bro Thomas, he was just the nicest dang guy ever! And Trujean was a trip!
It sure would be great someday to hear they all have been awakened and escaped the WT mindtrap.
And thanks to Winston for the scoop!
The 2000 Corporate split was all Henschel. Yes, he was nearly dead by the time, but he was the absolute commander of that transition. Always bear in mind that WTS is extremely slow when it comes to implementing changes. I know for a fact that nixing one meeting, and having only two monthly magazines was Henschel's idea. Ditto for not resporting bible studies (he actually wanted to get rid of all reporting of time). Those changes happened after he died, but he had set that machine in motion long before.
Anyone who knew Henschel well, could see that this guy didn't care at all about power. I think he was a truly honest person who firmly believed in what he was doing; he was sickened by the big egos around him. He ended for good all the GB glorification, to the point were right now 80% of JWs don't even know their names (as opossed to 90's when even kids could recite them). I always thought it was shame he wasn't in charge for longer. He would have changed a lot of stuff. Jaracz and Losche hated his guts.
Gary: You're absolutely right about most CO's being incompetent. More than an opinion that is a fact -privately aknwoledged by big wigs at the service department-. One of them once told me that some CO's create more problems than what they solved. That makes plausible geting rid of them.
Jeff: Very interesting stuff. I never heard about the "ecclesiastical" hierarchy clause, but it makes a lot of sense. Probably that's how they finally bought the idea of jumping out the Corporation. They work backstage, in the dark while keeping control.
Yknot: CO's for dummies... not a bad idea. Could finally make a buck out of those years.
Abbagall: Thanks for making the point that not all CO's were a-holes. I like to think I wasn't that bad.
Abbagall: Thanks for making the point that not all CO's were a-holes. I like to think I wasn't that bad.
Awww, with a name like Winston, how could you be bad at all? ;-)
Then again, the interaction I had with COs/DOs was not the same as elders who may be getting chewed out by them at every visit. ;-) So I had no grudges. They actually LIVENED UP the place and broke the Monotony when they would come to town. Moske was a clown. We actually got to LAUGH DURING meetings when he was on the platform, lol.
Interesting info about Henschel. Sad really. Was he the frail little guy, very old? Seems we may have seen him when at the Silentlambs March up there in 9/2002. There was a small frail very elderly GB'er who had two young guys, one on each side, as if they had to practically hold him up when he walked down the street.
