Well, real JW's and "worldy people" don't mix, but I do know that people have been helped to get out; my wife included. It just requires hard work and subtlty.
But, a relationship with a JW? Probably not possible, not without abject misery.
ashi
ANYONE IN SUCCESSFUL RELATIONSHIP WITH JW
by Serena 36 Replies latest social relationships
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Seeker4
Yes, I am.
But your posts here confirm what my wife and I have often talked about - we are by far the exception. I think our relationship is very, very unusual. I have left the Witnesses and am now essentially an atheist and in JW terms certainly an apostate, and my wife is still an active JW. We're third generation JWs.
Briefly, we've been married 30 years (married young), and went together since we were young teens. Were JWs of course. Raised three kids, pioneered, I was an elder, etc. etc. You get the picture. When I first started questioning we had a hard time, and eventually I left the Witnesses completely about five years ago.
That being hard enough, I also became involved sexually with a number of women over the past few years, which my wife now knows. It has been a very experimental and questioning time for me, to say the least. Actually, if you want to do a search of this website, I did a VERY open discussion of all of this on a thread here a few weeks ago.
That having been said, we are still together, our marriage is perhaps stronger than ever, and we still very much love each other. How is that possible?
A few things that I see are:
We are both willing to let the other person think the way they want, and still show a deep respect for one another. We NEVER name call or have violent fights or any of that stuff. We talk about all of it, but with real respect for the other.After knowing me for 35 years, my wife is well aware that I am not conventional in most ways, I often take risks, I live life on my own terms and I have a thirst for experience that can lead me to troubled waters at times. I think all of this is part of why she loves me and is willing to forgive me and overlook my failings. There have been very, very few boring times in our marriage. Some women would hate that - others would find it exciting. Some women want a steady, totally predictable guy, others want a confident man with a lot of drive and energy and interests. My wife is one of those, and she knows that being married to an interesting man can have it's costs - as can being married to a more boring one.
But most important out of all of this is that we have both been willing to compromise. She is certainly not a hard-line JW. I told her just a week or two ago that if she had been I'm certain our marriage would have been over several years ago. But she's been a JW long enough to have a clear view of what the org is, and what it isn't. For instance, this past weekend she went with me to a holiday brunch a friend of mine held. She had no problem explaining to the people who asked that she didn't celebrate Christmas. She's also a confident woman - and stunningly attractive. All that helps.
I've moved on with my life and have tons of non-JW friends now. She's seen that she needs to be a part of that life as well. Going to a lot of social events alone is a surefire way of connecting with attractive and willing women - or at least it is for me - and we've found that it's just a lot nicer for both of us if we do as much together as possible. So when invited, I gladly attend any JW gatherings or other events with her as well.
Has this been easy? ABSOLUTELY NOT! Again, if one of the partners in the relationship is a typical, "my way is the only right way, and you are a poor misled worldling" JW, then I think the relationship is doomed. You've got to have a partner that is willing to allow that they may be wrong in some of their thinking.
So I think we may be the exception that tends to prove the rule. We have hundreds of friends who are or were JWs, and can think of NONE that have stayed together under the same circumstances.
And one other vital factor in our relationship is humor. We have a huge amount of fun together - laughing often under the most difficult circumstances. My wife knows that I don't believe in the concept of a "soulmate," but I must say that we frequently know what the other is thinking, will come up with the same exact idea at the same time right out of the blue, and find the same things hilarious. So maybe I am married to my soulmate - or simply my best friend. Either way - despite my considerable shortcomings and weaknesses - neither of us plans on ending the marriage.
As my wife told me recently, "I've always dreamed that we would grow old together." We will.
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Erich
seeker:
Congratulations to you and your wife, and your friends (Jw's and nonJW's). Your story is fascinating and it teaches us to see some matters not too seriously....
But what I never can understand is the fact you've been an elder (who certainly studied the bible centuries of your life), and you are found now as atheist, evolutionist, nihilist... Did you ever set your feet on the stage, 100%-convinced that everything you are going to say is absolutely in accordance with your innermost belief and conviction?
I do not think in this way, and that's the reason why I never asked for speech or other "privileges" inside of JW's org. Never, since 20 years. I refused all encouragements.
I have full comprehension to plain proclaimers (JW's), who left the org caused through matters of injustice, but never regarding ex-elders. All elders (worldwide, exJW or active JW) are fully co-responsible for all the destructive decline in JW's org, and they will be made responsible and - if necessary - punished by the Almighty God himself. -
Seeker4
Erich,
I think we've discussed a few issues before on here.
You're main question seems to be: "Did you ever set your feet on the stage, 100%-convinced that everything you are going to say is absolutely in accordance with your innermost belief and conviction?"
My answer is yes. I was a true believer and totally convinced. Of course, I was in no way convinced that the WTS had THE TRUTH, but I did feel that it was the best I could find. And I was at peace with myself in all of this for most of that time. I was also a good student, and knew all the WTS arguments about science, evolution and so on. So that was where I STARTED when I began a serious investigation of those issues. Like it's theology, I found that WTS science collapsed quickly under serious, unbiased scrutiny. Therefore my intellectual move toward atheism and evolution. Facts are facts, and hard to honestly squirm away from.
I've grown and changed since then. I've often written here that I feel that for many of us, leaving the Witnesses was mainly a matter of outgrowing the very limited worldview of the Witnesses. When you become more of a spiritual person than the religion you belong to allows (or even more spiritual than the God you are claiming to worship!), then it is definitely time to move on.
As for nihilist, I don't know. Certainly don't believe that life is meaningless or useless in any way.
S4 -
butalbee
This is probably the best advice anyone could give you, listen very carefully: WHEN YOU SEE THEM COMING TO YOUR DOOR, WITH THEIR SMILING FACES, EAGER TO MESS WITH YOUR MIND, RUN FOR YOUR LIFE!!!
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JBean
The answer is yes... but only if the JW is the type to be layed-back about things and both individuals are good at compromise. Seeker's life seems to be working well now and I agree with a lot of his points. I spent YEARS trying to convert my hubby (I was born & raised in the faith)... we eventually divorced but not because of religion... lots of other crazy stuff. SInce then I have had 3 long-term boyfriends (all non-JW)...friends/family know about this but don't give me toooo many problems... don't ask me how I manage this! : ) Maybe because I went through a messy divorce and they're afraid I'll crack! hee! Also maybe because they forced the issue of not dating my ex and I married him... now they may think that if they let me do what I want, I won't marry these guys. I dunno. Anyway... all are completely unaware that I've had it with the organization and wouldn't spend a moment of my time in trying to convert the guy I'm with now. So for those of you who are in a relationship (or considering one) with a JW, I guess it depends on how strict they are. You can only tell by having open communication... and remember my example... years and years of trying to force the other person to change... and now look! : )
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ThatOneGuy
AjaxMan,
My Girlfreind isnt really active...She goes because shes only 17 and is forced by her parents...I just go to her church, Her parents allow me to talk to her but are always close by watching like vulture....I'm like 99% sure she is going to leave...If i hadn't screwed up with her a couple months ago she would be DF'ed right now but its better this way so now when she leaves she can accually keep her family
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Serena
He said that we shouldn't see each other or talk on the phone for a while, does that mean that we are done? That he had his fun and now he wants it to be over. He's scared of getting disfellowshipped. But he's not even an active witness. He seldom goes to meetings, and if I ask him a question about his faith, he anwsers but warns me that he hasn't been active in long time, his answers are always jumbled words, nothing like the reaction a true witness would answer to, but the one thing that he is sure of and that is the JW's is the truth. THE TRUTH. Even if he's forgotten or gotten confused on some of the religious beliefs, it's the truth. He is now studying with some ministral servant,via the influence of the elders. Oh by the way, his conscience made him tell the elders that he was fornicating with a worldly one, big mistake in my opinion. Right at this moment I am unable to understand him. A friend of mine says that pretty soon, they will convince him that I am satan tempting him to do wrong. I still love him and want nothing but to be with him. But I still feel used. I'm gullible, I look into his eyes and I melt like butter. I do though, sense that there is no future for us, call it womans'intuition, and right now I'm just trying to cling on to what we had.
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LoneWolf
I've known a couple. Probably the most successful would be my aunt who married right after World War II. She was raised in the Organization and fell in love with a soldier who was of neither the same race or religion.
They had four kids and she has been quite active all these years, while he has never shown any interest. They're in their seventies and still together. Kids are doing well.
LoneWolf
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Red Apple
Okay
So I'm not dating a JW but I have been in a relationship with a guy who has been disfellowshipped. We generally have a fantastic relationship and he is truly wonderful BUT I don't know a lot about the religion or his situation regarding being DF.
He HAS told me he was suspended 3-4 times in the last 10 years and then 4 years ago they said he couldn't not be accepted back into the religion because they didn't believe he truly wanted to be a part of it. Does this happen?
How deep does his belief in this religion go? He is obsessed with death - he strongly believes in the apocolypse & speaks of those in the religion knowing "the truth".
After being DF do ppl still believe what they were taught? Someone in the forum spoke of "losing their family if DF" my BF cannot attend meetings etc and his family were very unhappy when he did get kicked out - now he may not be able to attend his sisters upcoming wedding but is it true he has "lost his family?"
I'm confused - we had a big argument where I made a few comments regarding the religion that cut deep - I asssumed that because he was no longer a part of it he would not be upset with my views.This is the first time I've voiced my strong opions against the JW religion and the first time I've seen any real emotion from him regarding this.
Does everyone agree the belief system following being DF is just as strong as before? If so do you think its possible those who have been want to be accepted back?