Jerusalem destroyed 607 or 586/7?

isaacaustin

Let's try this again...most of us are aware that all available evidence points to the time of Jerusalem's destruction at the 586/7BC time frame. Overwhelming evidence includes astronomical phenomena, achaeological evidence, bank records, the Bible itself.

Some hold to 607BC, for obvious reasons- the implications it has.

Thoughts on how this would effect the average witness if forced to conclude 607 is wrong? Would it even make a difference to them as far as 1914? Would they try to weasle out anyway?

wobble

They try to argue that 1914 was such a significant year,and fits the Matt.24 prophecy, that it dosn't matter if Chuck Russells plagiarised crazy 2520 years dosn't work.

I had an MS claim this to me, I just gave up. (He could not grasp the significance that if 1914 is wrong then the GB was not chosen in 1919 and therefore are not what they say they are today, Cognitive Dissonance at its best!)

Love

Wobble

digderidoo

It wouldn't make any difference to them whatsoever, in fact i'd argue that it could be of benefit to them to accept 586/7

I have heard a witness say even if Jerusalem was destroyed in 587 that would mean Satan was cast down in 1934 and history shows that the last days prophecy has had a major fulfillment since 1934.

Think about it, what hapened in 1934? ... Hitler came to power

If the WTBTS took 1934 as the new date they could even bring back in the 'generation' teaching.

Paul

isaacaustin

IC....it really would not make a dent.

Amha·aret

They'd explain it away like they do with everything else.

The mind won't see what the mind don't wanna see!

isaacaustin

true..."it was fulfilled in other ways" etc...they probably would not even see the significance of it or understand

sspo

I talked to some good friends still in....and their response was....

So what? just a few years off.

The majority would not leave because they could care less about doctrines or about " Jehovah or FDS ",

for them it's the routine, the social aspect, family and the investment of many decades

in the religion. For most " Where else would i go " .

As Paul said " a form of godly devotion proves false to its power "

AnnOMaly

From my own experience (especially recently where I've had a several months long discussion with someone), there is a lot of weaselling out and attempts to undermine the evidence. Often the default position has been, 'We stick with the Bible rather than with imperfect, questionable and pagan records' as if it's 'either/or.'

But having said that, it has also been put forward that 587 BCE could be the year of Jerusalem's desolation, and 607 BCE (toward the end of Nabopolassar's reign when Nebuchadnezzar became viceroy) could be retained as the start of the Gentile Times which would still end in 1914. Unfortunately, 607 BCE can't be tied to a significant political event in Judah - Jehoiakim had been reigning about 2 years already and it would be another 2 years before Carchemish and Neb's sweep through the Hatti land putting Judah under his Gentile domination.

Changing 1914 to 1934 wouldn't work too well either, IMHO. The biblical parallels and certain interpretations of prophecy to do with the inspection and appointment of the 'slave' wouldn't gel with key events in WT history/lore - Babylonian captivity and release (jail time), revival of the two witnesses (convention call to get out preaching), etc. There's nothing of global significance that could even be loosely attached to any 'end of Gentile Times' in 1934, and I don't think JWs would buy it - too radical.

Obviously, correcting the date of Jerusalem's destruction would make average JWs fall into 2 camps: those who will just go along with the change and their faith in the org intact; and those who will be jolted awake by it, wondering how a spirit-directed organization serving the God of Truth could teach this falsehood for so long.

Olin Moyles Ghost

To a large majority of JWs it wouldn't matter. Most Witnesses don't understand JW chronology. They just roll with it.

The JWs don't need 607 to support their belief that the "last days" began in 1914. They just point to WWI starting in 1914 and then make some vague reference to "worsening world conditions" to prop up their end-times chronology.

But to me, even more damning than the 586/7 date for Jerusalem's destruction is the lack of any scriptural support for a second fulfillment of the prophecy. Where in Daniel is there any mention of a second fulfillment? I don't see it. Where is it in the NT? I don't see it there either. (I know that JWs point to Jesus' statement in Luke about Jerusalem being trampled by the nations until the appointed times of the nations are fulfilled...please! That single statement is supposed to tie an already-fulfilled prophecy in Daniel to something in 1914...really? You can't be serious.)

If you want to debate 1914 with a knowledgeable JW (which is often--but not always--an oxymoron), I recommend not focusing on the 607/587 issue. You can get bogged down in the details. Rather, I would have the JW explain (1) where the Bible says there is a 2nd fulfillment of the prophecy; (2) where it says the 2nd fulfillment should be calculated using a day for a year; (3) where the Bible says to use 360 day years to calculate the number of years but to use 365/6 day years to calculate the end of the period.

The way I see Daniel's prophecy is this. Old Testament God is a bit full of himself, and he wanted to teach Nebuchadnezzar a lesson in humility. So, God predicted that Neb would go crazy for 7 years and then be restored. According to Daniel, this happened. Thus, the prophecy was fulfilled and God was shown to be the big shot that he is. End of story.

Of course, that's not enough for some people. Over 2000 years later, the Adventists and Watchtowerites conjured up this idea that there must be a second fulfillment that would take place in their time. Thus, they shoved the round "day for a year" peg into the square hole and came up with 1914. It's laughably absurd when you take a step back and look at it.

Leolaia

Cue scholar in three, two, one....You're on....

Jerusalem destroyed 607 or 586/7?

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