Elimination of Jesus from Song Book?

by twinkletoes 59 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  twinkletoes

  I’ve recently been looking at a non-JW tract – this was an interesting paragraph

  Watchtower 1 st 1954 page 31

  There we read "Jehovah’s Witnesses are proud of the fact that they have eliminated from their song books, songs praising Jesus (Revelation, its grand climax at hand, page 36)"

  I was in the Org. for over 30 years and I must admit that I didn’t even notice these changes.

  We truly were brain-washed.

  I haven't got the Revelation book to check this out - Did anyone else notice or question this?
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  Black Sheep

  Revelation Climax, page 36

  "In the songbook produced by Jehovah’s people in 1905, there were twice as many songs praising Jesus as there were songs praising Jehovah God. In their 1928 songbook, the number of songs extolling Jesus was about the same as the number extolling Jehovah. But in the latest songbook of 1984, Jehovah is honored by four times as many songs as is Jesus. This is in harmony with Jesus’ own words: “The Father is greater than I am.” (John 14:28) Love for Jehovah must be preeminent, accompanied by deep love for Jesus and appreciation of his precious sacrifice and office as God’s High Priest and King."

  I don't recall having a problem with it. Cheers Chris
• 

  possible-san

  In this forum, I looked at explanation of the Trinitarians who say, "Jesus is Jehovah" repeatedly.
  I have explained at every time, "In the Trinity doctrine, Jesus is not Jehovah."
  http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/175170/1/ROMANS-10-13-NTW-on-the-wall-in-the-kingdom-halls
  http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/175020/1/Clarifying-the-Trinity-Doctrine
  
  
  If that as they say "Jesus is Jehovah" is true, "songs praising Jesus" is the same meaning as "songs praising Jehovah."

  possible
  http://godpresencewithin.web.fc2.com/
• 

  Narkissos

  But in the latest songbook of 1984, Jehovah is honored by four times as many songs as is Jesus.

  An odd question comes to mind. Did, or do the lyrics use the 2nd person (you) in addressing Jesus in those songs (which might be construed as *gasp* prayer)? (I can't seem to remember, and I don't have any songbook.)

  Actually the use of the 2nd person is most natural in hymnal poetry (eulogy or elegy for instance: when David is "addressing" the dead Jonathan in his lamentation nobody thinks that he is "talking with the dead" or "praying Jonathan"). Even in mainstream churches addressing Jesus is way more common in songs than in prayer. But it would be fun to see if (when, how) the WT jesuphobia went to the point of "eliminating" the 2nd-person address to Jesus in songs.
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  twinkletoes

  Thank you all for your replies.

  Blacksheep - Chris, I appreciate you putting the info on here for me. Eventually, as you quote, Jehovah has four times as many songs (in the 1984 book) as Jesus. I have become very wary and sceptical of everything that I read now, and it's good to see what actually was printed. The non-JW tract implied that songs about Jesus had been eliminated, but on reading it again, I can see that I thought that they meant ALL songs about Jesus had been eliminated !

  Possible - interesting point - the tract where this info was taken from, appears to be from Christians who believe in the Trinity, so as you say, songs praising Jehovah could be thought of as songs praising Jesus, so if that is the case, they hadn't really eliminated songs praising Jesus!

  Narkissos - "But it would be fun to see if (when, how) the WT jesuphobia went to the point of "eliminating" the 2nd-person address to Jesus in songs."

  Perhaps others would be able to answer on this point. Like you, I do not have a song book anymore, and I've been trying hard to recall the various songs in it. All I can remember, is that we often said (me & Hubby KT) it's a pity that they got rid of some of the old songs.

  Many thanks to you all

  Twinkletoes
• 

  yadda yadda 2

  How does the Songbook compare with the emphasis on Jesus in the NT? Jesus is the main emphasis in the New Testament. The focus is clearly on him throughout. Jesus said that the holy spirit would come upon his disciples and they would be witnesses of him, not Jehovah. The name 'Jehovah' isn't even found in all extant texts.
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  passwordprotected

  Jesus said we need to honour him just as we honour the Father. If we don't honour the Son, we're not honouring the Father.

  Removing honour from Jesus actually removes honour from the Father, whom JWs believe to be Jehovah.
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  possible-san

  Mr. passwordprotected.

  I feel that your explanation looks stupid.

  You are a person who believes clearly "Jesus IS Jehovah."
  So, for you, "Jehovah" and "Jesus" are exchangeable divine name.

  After all, you also say "Jesus is Jehovah", in order to emphasize "Jesus" rather than "Jehovah."
  http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/175170/1/ROMANS-10-13-NTW-on-the-wall-in-the-kingdom-halls

  Only when you attack the doctrine of Jehovah's Witnesses, what you say "Jehovah is only the Father" is not allowed.

  possible
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  passwordprotected

  @ possible - I never understand your posts, so I'm sorry if I don't even try to interpret what you're trying to say.
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  passwordprotected

  Ehp 4: 8 Wherefore he says: “When he ascended on high he carried away captives; he gave gifts [in] men.”

  Paul is here writing about Jesus. He is quoting;

  Psalm 68: 18 You have ascended on high;

  You have carried away captives;

  You have taken gifts in the form of men, Yes, even the stubborn ones, to reside [among them], O Jah God.

  So, Paul attributes a verse in the Psalms about Jah God (Jehovah?) to Jesus.

  However, Jehovah's Witnesses believe that Jehovah is God the Father. They consistently put Jesus into a subordinated position to Jehovah, even choosing to give more honour to Jehovah than to Jesus.

  If Jehovah is the God the Father, how does this affect the Jehovah's Witness refusal to honour Jesus;

  John 5: 22 For the Father judges no one at all, but he has committed all the judging to the Son, 23 in order that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. He that does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent him.