by aChristian 251 Replies latest jw friends
Either way, global or local, it's still just a myth. Why believe in such a ridiculous tale? Do you believe the adventures in the Odyssey really happened too? I suppose you guys also believe in the "Tower of Babel" story too. Pretty creepy behavior for adults if you ask me.
rem, who still believes in Paul Bunyan
"We all do no end of feeling, and we mistake it for thinking." - Mark Twain
Mr. Christian this seems very interesting but I am interestd by what authority do you base your apologetic claims?
http://www.reformed.org/apologetics/At_War_With_the_Word.html
this article will give an idea what I mean. did you know it was the presuposition methodology that got me out of the WT.
rem writes:(snip)
"rem, who still believes in Paul Bunyan"
Response: I like John Bunyan better "Pilgrams Progress was so cool"
pass me another Hieniken,
jr
Wiltshire, I did not say who wrote Genesis and for this topic that's irrelevant.
Rem, you're also off topic, but as to a tower in Babel, there were towers/ziggurats there; and the "world" of the Middle/Near East has a number of language families in that region of the world:
Turkish,
Kurdish, (Indo-European)
Hittite, (extinct Indo-European)
Arabic & Hebrew (Semitic)
Most of you are falling into the trap of assuming "earth" and "world" always refer to the entire planet. When that misconception is straightened out, science and the Bible tend to meld.
anewperson,
Most of you are falling into the trap of assuming "earth" and "world" always refer to the entire planet. When that misconception is straightened out, science and the Bible tend to meld.Did you read the linked article by JanH on whether the Genesis flood could have been local?
Most of you are falling into the trap of assuming "earth" and "world" always refer to the entire planet. When that misconception is straightened out, science and the Bible tend to meld.
Ahhh!!! So now I see how 2+2=5!!!! It's because the first two isn't actually two, it's two units of half of three, and the second two means actually two units of twice of one. There, you see? That is how two plus two indeed equals 5. As long as you have the proper "understanding".
Next week, I'll cover how yes means no, and up actually means nowhere.
Anewperson,
Just because there were towers and different languages in the area doesn't mean that the story is true. That's why it's called a myth. Just because a story, such as Shakespeare's plays, contains factual elements, doesn't turn the story into nonfiction. Perhaps the towers and languages were inspiration for the myth, but the story is still clearly a myth.
The same is true with the Flood myth. There may have been a large local flood someplace that was inspiration for the story, but the story is still a myth. It is fiction. So really it doesn't matter if a meteor impact created a flood at some point in the Middle East. Even if there was a flood, there was no Noah, no animals, and no Ark. They are fictional characters. The story is still a myth.
rem
"We all do no end of feeling, and we mistake it for thinking." - Mark Twain
Clash,
You asked: By what authority do you base your apologetic claims?
I claim no authority and I make no apologetic claims. Christians are free people. We are permitted to read the Bible and, with the help of the Holy Spirit, decide for ourselves what we believe the Bible is saying. We are also permitted to share our understandings with others. And they are permitted to accept our understandings as being probably correct or reject them as being probably incorrect. That is the way it should be. I do not want any "authority" telling me what the Bible means. And I certainly would never treat others in that way. The men who run the Watchtower Society claim to have "authority" to interpret the Bible for others. They are a shining example of what you can expect from those who make such claims.
aChristian,
I think you misunder stood me of coursechristians are free to read the bible. this isn't the WT or Rome.
when I mean authority, I'm looking for what is your starting point
A. Do you start with scriptures alone(sola scriptora) as the authority. ie. the bible says 6 litteral days creation(wich BTW the WT denies) or the flood was 40 days of rain, and so on.
B. Man's ascertions. ie. Survey says the flood was a local thing. Unbelieving athiestic scientist from Arizona State say the bible is legend...and so on
does the bible judge man or man judge the bible
evedential apologetics(man-centered) vs. Presuppositional Apologetics(God-Centered)
Clash,
You asked: Do you start with scriptures alone (sola scriptora) as the authority?
As I mentioned earlier, I believe Christians should read the Bible with the help of the Holy Spirit, and then decide for themselves what they believe the Bible is saying. (I John 2:27) This approach is more than the scriptures alone.
So far as your saying that a "scriptures alone" approach would require us to understand that when Genesis says that God created the world in six days that it must mean "six literal (24 hour) days," I believe you are in error. For if such were the case we would also have to believe that God created the heavens and the earth in only one day. For Genesis 2:4 speaks of "the day that the Lord God made the earth and the heavens." Now, which is it? Did God do it all in six days or in one day? There is no contradiction here for the reasonable person. The writer of Genesis obviously used the word "day" as we often do, to refer to a larger period of time. As in, "In my father's day things were done differently." The six days (or periods of time) in which God created our world, when spoken of together, can be referred to as one day (or period of time).
So far as "man's assertions" go, I pay them little attention. I do, however, listen to God's Holy Spirit and use the common sense God gave me. And I believe the Holy Spirit has often reminded me that the Bible contains much non-literal language. The Book of Revelation comes to mind. So do Jesus' words that we must eat his flesh and drink his blood to gain life. God expects the reader of scripture to use their discernment in determining when we should understand the scriptures in the simplest, most literal way and when we should understand the scriptures in a deeper, less literal, way.
God gave us good minds and the ability to reason. I'm sure He expects us to use them both when we are studying His word.
