You two people; Rachel, Tuesday - you're the same person, aren't you?
Sass_My_Frass: I don't think so, but how can we tell for sure?
"I'm Perfect, You're Doomed" discussion...
by Tuesday 58 Replies latest jw friends
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GoddessRachel
I started to go through each of your points, Tuesday, and try and respond to them, and frankly the whole thing has gotten so convoluted, it's just not worth it to me. I don't think I'm wrong in what I posted. I don't have ill motives. It seems really strange to me that you are upset that I read into your motives for not liking the book while you simultaneously read into my motives for posting. Are you the kettle or the pot? Never mind, it's rhetorical, please don't answer it, I beg of you. Instead I will post why I like this book, because going around and around arguing with you is going to get us nowhere, as well as annoy all the other posters. And no, that doesn't mean I don't have a number of good arguments in response to your arguments; it just means I really don't want to argue. I'm raising my little white flag here. I would apologize here if I thought it would actually make a difference to you, but I really don't think it will since you seem to think I'm being "sarcastic" and "pissy." (I'm not.) So, without further ado, as they say, what I liked about I'm Perfect, You're Doomed:
To me, Kyria effectively showed just how ludicrous the whole thing is, to fail to teach people how to truly decipher right from wrong, and then condemn them for making poor choices in life. The quote that really sums it up best is in the last pages of her story, where she points out that it’s hard to feel like anything is wrong when you are told that murder is as wrong as eating birthday cake, as wrong as smoking, as wrong as reading books, as wrong as having sex with your friend’s boyfriend.
It’s something I personally refer to as Baby Bathwater Syndrome. All the good things we learned as Jehovah’s Witnesses, when I first left, I lumped everything together, and threw it all out. It was like throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Only the bathwater is dirty, the baby is valuable. However, anything that I associated with Jehovah’s Witnesses had to go. It resulted in my making some terrible decisions, and through some painful learning experiences I have slowly been bringing those values back into my life that really have nothing to do with the Jehovah’s Witnesses, other than that they really do try to be good people, and as such teach some good moral values.
I applaud Kyria for breaking through those stupid stereotypes and simply telling her story, with wit and humor and candor. She should be applauded. Anyone who reads her book will see how ridiculous many of the Jehovah’s Witness practices are. Her book for me was like a breath of fresh air because she talked on some heavy stuff but approached it in a lighthearted manner. For me, at this stage in my exodus from the JW's, it was a relief to be able to laugh along with her, rather than feeling so heavy-hearted about it all the time, because as we all know, it is some heavy stuff. It was the right book for me in this moment of my life. I have read plenty of others that I loved just as much for very different reasons. I look forward to reading many more books on the subject.
Rachel
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GoddessRachel
I find that hard to believe, mathematically there are at least 5 million ex-JWs out there and there's no way the usual is to fall into those stereotypes. I also don't think that they're normal, why are people so offended by racial stereotypes but us ex-JWs are cool with being stereotyped by active JWs? I find it offensive purpotrating a stereotype. I'm irish as well, one of the stereotypes is that irish people drink too much. I don't drink at all and many irish people I know also don't drink. Everytime we see the stereotypical drunken irish-man we all get annoyed because it's not true. Or yourself being gay, do you think it's cool when people stereotype all gay people as S&M leather wearing people who will hook up with anyone they feel like?
It's the same thing here.
One more thing: I think you give way too much power to stereotypes. You are never going to be able to control the things other people say. There will always be stereotypes. I think focusing so intensely on the stereotypes in something is not an effective way to accomplish anything, unless what you are trying to accomplish is being obsessed with stereotypes.
You are right that I am defensive about this book; I am defensive because Kyria Abrahams told her story, and you seem to want her to have changed the events just to not prove stereotypes right. It is a bizarre concept to me. It's her memoir. I think the point is to tell what is, stereotypes and all. I guess I feel like you are going beyond saying you don't like the book because of its stereotypes and actually suggesting it was wrong for Abrahams to publish such a book because you think she will do more harm than good to people who might otherwise leave the JW's. I feel that it is very judgmental for you to say such a thing. Don't like a book, fine, but who are you to suggest it shouldn't even exist in the first place?
So, you have NEVER proved one of those apostate stereotypes right? NEVER? (This is a real question, should you choose to answer it.) I find that really hard to believe, though if it is true, I have to say I'm impressed, and also a little bit concerned that you are suppressing some normal things in the name of stereotypes created by a fraud religious organization.
I'm done for real now, I swear. Unless I think of something else. I am not trying to argue though; I am trying to understand!
Rachel
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GoddessRachel
Tuesday, I was thinking about this a lot last night, and suddenly it dawned on me (duh): You are damn proud of yourself for having resisted so many things in the name of not proving those ugly stereotypes to be true.
As you should be.
I think my understanding that alone clears up for me why you are so against people proving ex-JW stereotypes right. Because you have worked so hard to prove them wrong.
Seems rather obvious now that I've typed it out.
Anyway, I'm proud of you too. For whatever that is worth. You are a very strong person.
I would like you to know that I am living my life now, everyday, moving forward, by making the best decisions possible, and always striving to do the right thing. Something I didn't used to do. I guess you could say I'm growing up. :-)
Peace,
Rachel
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Mad Sweeney
I understand writing a book as some sort of catharsis, she must have proof-read this book before putting it out. I don’t know how she can’t see herself as just the biggest whiny, spoiled, little brat imaginable. I have read stories about JWs who have been disfellowshipped which really seemed they were on a rollercoaster and they had no control over what was happening because the way they were raised. I’ve read stories that made me cry, they moved me completely. Did bad things happen to this girl? Of course, you were raised in a cult my dear. It comes with the territory. However, at every instance the only thing I could bring myself to is: you brought this upon yourself.
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For the life of me I don’t know why anyone would feel sympathy in the slightest for this girl. Don’t get me wrong, I’m all about people writing about their time in the organization warts and all, it seems she focused so much on the warts though. Well, let me know anyone who’s read the book if they feel similarly or differently.
For the first few chapters of the book I didn't feel this but as the book went on, I came to agree. As the book progressed, the author seemed to stop making connections between her hare-brained behaviors and her JW upbringing, and she rarely elaborated on the thought processes involved in making her decisions. If the reader is supposed to believe she did all these things without thinking because JWs don't teach their members how to think, the message was far too subtle. If the reader is supposed to believe she did all these things because JW born-ins suffer from arrested development, again, the book doesn't even make it implicit, let alone explicit.
Summary of the book: I grew up a JW. JWs believe this, that, and the other. I did all these myriad of stupid things and stopped being a JW because those stupid things aren't allowed. The end.
Somewhere in the middle the connection between her behavior and her JW upbringing got lost, and to me that was the most important part of the book.
The humor was good but it was also nonstop. By the end it was so commonplace that it was no longer funny.
I would still recommend the book to ex-JWs, especially New Englanders, but it isn't really for someone still working out the process of leaving. It's for people already out.
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HiddenPimo
So I didn't want to start a new thread, but I just found this book on Amazon and it is a good read. You can see yourself in all the situations described (I meant I could see myself). Great story of how wild and crazy the JW life was before waking up...
I'm Perfect, You're Doomed by Kyria Abrahams
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ToesUp
I have seen this book before but have not read it yet. I love the title. A perfect title to describe the JW's. lol
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stan livedeath
I knew i had bought it..a search on amazon found it..in 2010. I read most of it....got bored and gave it away..
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ZindagiNaMilegiDobaara
This post just made me want ot read the book.
here goes what I think (two pennies worth) . Everyone is entitled to see things their way based on the lens they watching it with.
I thank everyone for their differing opinions which adds variety to an outlook.
Like "Many factors come together to create this specific unique person which is I. — Frederick S. Peris, Gestalt Therapy Verbatim".
I believe we all have a personality and traits of our own which when we become jws makes a fusion /merges into a combination of jw traits and our own resulting in good n bad in our life n actions.
here goes: Found the book funny no doubt,lighthearted at first. Enjoyed the humour very much so, I started liking the kyria's household (apart from a few things) seemed normal in some ways and not in many others.
I just loved the humour so much but could see the seriousness through the humour. The odd quirky innuendos pulled me to her sad situation and the parallels she makes in it.Like
1. “I love Jehovah with my whole heart, my whole soul, and my whole m ind,” I told the elder who held my performing future in the palm o f his formerly violent hand".
2. The succession of power was this: Jesus was the head over man; man was the head over woman; and woman was the head over cooking peach cobbler and shutting up."
A great read from a different though revealing perspective.
Making light of her sad plight drew me to Kyria.
Only upto 13 pages.
Zing