Reniaa whines: " I find attacking then just dwelling on old wt's a very poor debating technique"
**** Too bad you can't DEFEND anything against that "very poor debating technique".
All poor lil Reniaa can do is whine about Vinny technique vinny this vinny that blah blah blah. Because she sure can't touch the ARGUMENTS proving Watchtower aint God's anything.
Hey Reniaa, I'm sure Jehovah was behind all this embarrassments. Hey Reniaa why not take another WHIFF: http://www1.tip.nl/~t661020/wtcitaten/part1.htm
Yep, that sure proves God chose Watchtower alright.
Reniaa whines again: "I also find people that need to do declaritive statements on beating someone had the exact opposite happen."
**** Sorry Reniaa, THirdwitless was TROUNCED just like you've been TROUNCED AND SPANKED too many times to count here.
Nobody can defend all that sorry Watchtower nonsense.
Do you want me to post all those times you were SPANKED and then HEADED FOR THE HILLS ?
That's how bad defending Watchtowerland, "as God's channel", is Reniaa. You always LOSE .
Hey reniaa, If the JW's were "God's People" (as you laughably claim), used by God, "His Channel today, "the faithful slave" blah blah blah, then THE FACTS WOULD SUPPORT SUCH LOFTY CLAIMS AS THESE THAT JW'S MAKE ABOUT THEMSELVES.
BUT THE FACTS DO NOTHING OF THE KIND. Flip flops, medical blunders, scientific embarrassments, false predictions, historical failures ((( IS ))) the WT Society history! Surely God can do better than this. AND HE (((DID))) DO BETTER THAT THAT ALREADY!!! Jesus did many amazing things. Moses did many amazing things. There was no doubt that if these things written about them were true that God was definitely behind them and using them. But one close look at WT World is LAUGHABLE for the WT World. THEY ARE WRONG ON BLOOD TODAY. That is one sorry mess they have on their hands that literally allows people (including little children) to DIE without reason. Hey Reniaa, do you let your own children DIE if blood could save them? Please tell. THE JW'S ARE WRONG FOR SHUNNING ALL THOSE THAT SIMPLY WALK AWAY TODAY. There is no scripture, anywhere, at any place in the bible that says to shun the man that believes in Christ yet walks away from the JW religious institution. NONE. Yet these are just two (((CURRENT JW POLICIES))) that are wrong right now. They are CURRENTLY wrong about disfellowshipping those that simply disagree with WT teachings. Read Romans 14 about "inward questionings" and try justifying why nobody can disagree with WT-land without getting AXED. They also just recently flip-flopped again on 1935. How many people did the WT Society LOCK OUT of this "favored relationship" with God and Christ before they passed away because the WT magazine said it was "sealed in 1935"? Just another embarrassment Reniaa. They are wrong on BEARDS today. No good brother, with any kind of beard, (even a neat and trimmed one) can carry a microphone in the KIngdom Hall in the good ole USA. (Poor little JW's with a beard). How's that scriptural? Go ahead answer up for us Reniaa. They were wrong about Vacinations, Organ Transplants, Alternative Service, Beth Sarim, Rape Rules, wrong about Sex with animals or with the opposite sex not breaking marriage ties. They were wrong about 1914 being the end of the world, then 1925, 1975, 2000, the generation that was alive in 1914 being around when the end came. They were wrong about kids not needing college cause the end would come before they grew old. They arrogantly say that, "WE ARE THE ONLY TRUE RELIGION" --despite their embarrassing, sorry past.
And then go even further in their pomp and back slapping by saying every other religion on the earth as well as all those who are a part of those religions will ALL BE DESTROYED unless becoming A JW. The JW religion loses more of their own children raised in the faith THAN ANY OTHER RELIGIOUS FAITH ON THE EARTH TODAY. They have made mistakes and continue to make mistakes today. Yet, the WT Society also claims that God has selected and directs them (and only them) today. Do you see a problem with these two contradictory issues Reniaa? Does God make mistakes Reniaa? Does God continue to change his mind like WT Society has? Does God get things wrong Rerniaa? Would he serve bad food at the wrong time again and again? Or does the very fact that the WT Society had/has many things wrong indicate to you (and most thinking persons today) that God was never behind these decisions at all. That instead, perhaps these thousands of mistakes (many of which literally cost people their very lives), have been the result of poor decisions made by a few fallible MEN sitting around in some New York city office, that just so happen TO CLAIM God is using them and only them today? Most reasonable people would at the very least be suspicious when men make great claims about God using them exclusively, yet having the very facts then proving God was never behind those decisions at all because they turned out to be wrong and in many cases ARE STILL WRONG TODAY. Those many mistakes, made as a COLLECTIVE GROUP AND PUBLISHED AS "FOOD FROM GOD" present a huge dilemma for such claims that God has selected them. If some salesman at a used car dealership was trying to sell you a very nice looking car, obviously you would be drawn to that car's positive strengths. Maybe it has a beautiful, well maintained exterior with no rust and like-new paint. Brand new tires, a great sound system, motor sounds smooth and more. You see, right away, those positive qualities would stand out to you and most anybody checking it out. As they probably should. BUT... then, what if you also found out that very same car had a SLIPPING TRANSMISSION when you drove it. Do you just ignore this major problem because you see the good that also exists and which you may be more drawn towards? What if after taking it to a mechanic to check out, you found out the frame had been welded in certain places because the car was in a major accident? Do you just forget about that fact because you like color? What if the car overall has a poor record of reliability? Hyundai sure ain't the same as Honda when it comes to historical and reliability records, though they may sound the same. You see it would be FOOLISH AND STUPID to simply look the other way when it comes to examining any possible PROBLEMS with any used car. The salesman may tell you ONLY THE GOOD THINGS about that car. Which is why it would be the wise and prudent thing to have a neutral party (usually some unbiased mechanic) to examine it closely and carefully for you. And how nice to ask a person that used to own that same kind of car how they felt about it as well. There are some good things about being a JW too; just as there are some good things about most any used car out there. But when you look at the ENTIRE JW PICTURE , you will defintely see many problems. Significant problems. (((((EVEN LIFE CHANGING PROBLEMS)))))!!! The WT Society has (no exaggerations here), one of the ABSOLUTE WORST historical and reliability records of any religious institution during the past 100 years. And this fact despite the arrogant, haughty and presumptuous claims that God has selected ONLY THEM TODAY, and that every other religion on the earth today, and people of those religions (regardless of how kind, sweet, spiritual, active, righteous etc they are) are all going to be destroyed by God unless they become a JW too. The JW's will tell any bible study only about the GOOD THINGS (just like some used car salesmen will do the same about a car he wants to sell). But where does that bible study hear about all those false predictions? Where does that bible study learn about the WT Society being WRONG on Vaccinations, Organ transplants, Alternative Service, Beth Sarim, Rape Rules, Marriage Ties not being broken by sex with animals or homosexuality and hundreds of other things like these? NO BIBLE STUDY WILL EVER HEAR THESE THINGS FROM ANY JW TEACHING THEM TODAY. I would know, I studied for three years, was baptized for 15 years and even was an elder for several years. Yet I never heard of most of these things I just mentioned here. In fact, how strange would it be, if a used car salesman actually FORBID YOU from going to former owners of that same car you are thinking of buying to get information about that used car. Yet this is the exact policy that JW's have about former JW members today. You are not allowed to speak to EX-JW's regardless of why they left or what kind of person they are today. This is not an exaggeration. Nor is this a healthy, Godly or scriptural policy either. But such is the facts here for all JW's on 7-2-2009. Which is why my wife and I always tell people to examine examine examine. The more a person learns about the entire JW picture, the better educated they will be to make an informed decision. While most that have fully examined the WT Society end up saying thanks but no thanks to remaining a JW it does occasionally happen. But at least then they know what they are getting into. At least they know more than those that only study with JW's. Which is why folks like me occasionally show up and share the facts about the WT Society in public venues like this and SPANK folks like you Reniaa. These things prove to most thinking people that God has not chosen the WT Society at all. There are many good things about the Mormons too. They are very moral people, have closer family ties (and family study nights) than the JW's do. They do not do drugs, or drink any alcohol, they go door to door worldwide and have a very united brotherhood along with twice as many in number as the JW's. But do these positive qualities then mean that they alone have the true faith? Well, this is what Mormons believe about Mormons btw, that they are the true church today. (I have the e-mails to prove it). Just like JW's believe about JW's. But when you look at either religious institution more closely, you will see numerous problems. (Like a pretty colored car but with engine rods a knocking ).... ALL JW"S WILL NOT ONLY HAVE TO ACCEPT EVERY NEW JW POLICY (JUST LIKE THAT HORRENDOUS BLOOD POLICY), BUT MUST ALSO TEACH IT AND INSIST OTHERS FOLLOW IT TO EVEN GET BAPTIZED. Same goes for policies on shunning, the current teachings on all those dates and everything else. You simply MUST ACCEPT these things and even promote them to others to become and to remain a JW. Which is why so few ever become a JW once they learn all the facts. And though despite SIGNIFICANT CONSEQUENCES ARE HEAPED UPON THEM, many even go as far as leaving the JW's once they have been truly enlightened. As happened with me. And often will end up stopping by here. Many JW doctrines literally caused people following them to DIE. No exaggeration. Did you need a kidney, liver, heart or more between 1967-1980? What do you think happened to those obedient JW's that refused based on the WT Society position that such transplants are "cannibalism"? Same with vaccinations from 1929 to 1952. Or alternative service for over 50 years. And blood for over 65 years and counting. Here, read this story for example: http://www.ajwrb.org/experiences/stories.shtml#kidney And if the JW's did not accept every single teaching as just that, from God's chosen organization, guess what happens? YEP, Counseled, then judicial meetings and then THE AXE; DISFELLOWSHIPPED and shunned by all JW's including your own family FOR LIFE. So you see an honest examination of the JW past clearly shows that Jehovah was never behind such teachings. If God was NOT behind them then, as the facts prove conclusively, what makes anybody believe He is behind them now? JW's have always claimed that God has chosen them. The facts do not support such grandiose and self righteous claims. Any thinking person can learn much from examining the history of an individual, an organization, government leader and more. When you want to buy a house, what to the creditors do? They carefully look over your credit "HISTORY". Because they can then learn what kind of track record you have. Want a Job, you fill out an application which includes past employment. ONE CLOSE LOOK AT THE PAST CAN OFTEN GIVE AN INDICATION ABOUT THE FUTURE!!! For me, such evaluations make sense. They are fair to do. And in the case of the WT Society such honest evaluations can reveal much that contradicts what the WT itself says about itself. Like I already said, WT has the all time worst record on false predictions, medical disasters, doctrinal and historical failures of any religion during the past 100 years. So tell us how YOU might reconcile these two opposing viewpoints then. WT got it wrong.WT got it wrong. WT got it wrong. WT is Jehovah's channel for dispensing food at this time. WT got it wrong. WT got it wrong WT got it wrong. WT is only place for salvation. WT got it wrong WT CURRENTLY has it wrong. WT CURRENTLY has it wrong. WT is God's channel for spiritual food today. You see the big PROBLEM on your hands now? What do all these mistakes and problems do for such arrogant claims the WT makes about itself? You are going to have to come up with some answers, at least in your own mind. You are going to have to explain what all these mistakes and current unscriptural policies do for the WT grandiose claims. You see, we need to base such decsions of whether the WT is chosen by God on logic, facts, proof, the past track record as well as. Don't you think? By doing an honest examination of the JW faith, which includes looking at its history, looking at the good AND THE BAD, one will come to perhaps a slightly DIFFERENT conclusion than if one simply TAKES THEIR WORD FOR IT. Reniaa thinks God chose Watchtower. BUT MOST HERE BELIEVE YOU HAVE BEEN MISLED. And the difference between you and I is that I can back up those beliefs and claims with history, with facts, with scripture and good old fashion common sense. And all you can say Vinny has bad debate technique. heh Vinny