hi everybody and my story

by inbetween 44 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  rebel8

  Welcome.

  Child abuse reports, by their nature, will usually be one-sided. Perps generally don't molest while on stage at an assembly under a spotlight with 10,000 eye witnesses.

  You don't have to believe victim reports or eye witness reports (such as my experience, being a therapist and trying not to strangle the perp dad elder when he threatened my patient with DFing if she told the other elders or cops).

  What you can do is read court documents. Testimony given under oath. Law enforcement testimony that elders destroyed liturgical records of counseling perps, even when there was a court order to turn them over.

  You can also read the many news reports on the subject, and watch the Dateline expose.

  You can also read wts' own words about not reporting things to the police, and their current policy of not turning over perps to the cops/warning the congregation unless required to by law.

  I encourage you to use the search function on this website to find stories you can research further via outside sources. You can also look through the "best of" folder here, and mine its many gems.
• 

  Chalam

  Hi inbetween and welcome aboard!

  An interesting read :) Some similar themes with others who find their way here of course.

  I will address some of the things you have brought up as pros

  encouraging bible reading, going to the source, other religions often do not bother or even not believe anymore in Gods word.

  The bible is central to my beliefs and millions of others. But then I am a born again Christian :)

  preaching work, ok others done it too, but not to the extent as the JW, also not about the kingdom,

  IMHO opinion, not true. This point was raised also by my JW friend so I assume the believe propagates from WT spin. "Preaching" is not only door to door. I am preaching the Kingdom now! Also, as you have found, door to door is not effective at all. Now, if you want to see some effective preaching then watch this. This ministry has seen 40 million enter the Kingdom alone! There are over a million at this one meeting :)

  Lagos,Reinhard Bonnke

  What is really important is what kindgom are the WT preaching? Is it this Kingdom?

  Luke 17:20-21 (New International Version)

  The Coming of the Kingdom of God

  20 Once, having been asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, Jesus replied, "The kingdom of God does not come with your careful observation, 21 nor will people say, 'Here it is,' or 'There it is,' because the kingdom of God is within [ a ] you." The Kingdom of God that is within you is where the Holy Spirit lives, where Christ is King. Read here where Jesus talks about the Holy Spirit John 14

  neutrality, as a group known for not participating in war, ( WWII, Ruwanda etc)

  I won't bother debating this too much as it is not a core issue for me. I am for peace and I hate war. However, I don't not know if the bible calls Christians to never take up arms. If we hadn't then Hitler's regime could still be in power now! Lasting peace will only come when Christ returns. Until then, we are to be peacemakers first and foremost.

  difference to some confusing teachings in Christianity, like trinity, immortal soul, hellfire etc (I read some of the arguments on this site, they just didnt convince me otherwise)

  OK, read your bible. It is the highest authority. Let it judge doctrine and theology, not man. I highly recommend you read pretty much any bible save the NWT. That said, you will still find the NWT totally contradicts some of the core WT doctrine. See the recent thread on the Holy Spirit not being a person for example.

  promotes a life, which is not so bad, shields of many bad habits common in world today, gives hope etc, therefore bringing out the best in some people, also bad things though in others...

  For me, life only comes via the Holy Spirit living on the inside of the believer. See John 14 again and here for example

  Titus 3:4-7 (New International Version)

  4 But when the kindness and love of God our Savior appeared, 5 he saved us, not because of righteous things we had done, but because of his mercy. He saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit, 6 whom he poured out on us generously through Jesus Christ our Savior

  Notice the verse talk of being born again, "rebirth". Also that God is our Saviour and also Jesus Christ is our Saviour! Also of God's grace, salvation is a free gift, not because of "works".

  Anyhow, stick around. You will find out much info regarding dates, doctrines and stuff. If you really want to continue seeking God (which you obviously do) then you are ultimately going to have to leave or else dumb down your conscience and keep up the pretense.

  All the best,

  Stephen
• 

  AnnOMaly

  inbetween

  

  It's a common reaction, when you start checking into things and coming to different conclusions about the org's teachings, to think you must be a hypocrite in still keeping with the 'theocratic routine.' Please dispel that idea. All you are doing is figuring stuff out. There's no point throwing in the towel, or upsetting family and friends if you're still in the 'finding out,' 'how does this affect my belief system?' and 'what are my options?' stages.

  Regarding some of your 'pros' -

  There are many flavors of Christian out there, from the 'anything goes' type to the fundamentalist, hard core Bible bashers, but it's simply not fair to make a broad brush stroke and say other religions don't bother with or believe the Bible. You'd be surprised how many respect the Bible as God's Word and try to live in accordance with its tenets.

  Issues like the Trinity, soul and hell depend on the scriptural dots you join. Trinitarians have some good scriptural arguments for their view. I'm not saying they're without flaws or counter-arguments, but their understanding about God's and Jesus' natures wasn't pulled out of thin air and they are trying to be 'God honoring' rather 'God dishonoring.' There are other mainstream Christians who don't believe the soul is inherently immortal or that hellfire is literal and involves eternal conscious torment. There are so many debates and discussions out there, it'll take time to sift through them and come to a more informed understanding.

  It's true that JWs' trademark is the door to door preaching, and yet how was the world evangelized before JWs came about (and it was)? Also it's interesting that the Seventh Day Adventists, for example, began as a movement at roughly the same time the Bible Students/JWs did, and yet they have twice the number of members globally, if we're comparing active JW members (if inactive members are included, the figures are nearly the same - source: http://www.adherents.com/adh_rb.html ). SDAs don't go door to door but they're obviously doing some kind of evangelization.

  The 'not sures yet' -

  Child abuse - victims' treatment in the past has (on the whole) been appalling and the org was slow to shape up - more concerned with image/reputation than justice and protection - a lot of hurt. It seems one-sided because a flood of victims have the courage now to shout up. But there's plenty online to get a pretty good picture of the situation.

  607/1914 - ha, don't get me started (one of my hobby horses). Carl Olof Jonsson's book, Gentile Times Reconsidered is a must-have but you'd have to hide it from all JW friends and relatives. This issue is the first domino. Nudge that, and a whole row of unique JW teachings topple over. It's a biggie, but realizing the truth about 607/1914 lifts a veil from our eyes and puts so many other JW doctrines into perspective.
• 

  wobble

  Big WELCOME Inbetween,

  For me it became a matter of conscience, I could not be happy being a part of a religion that had maybe a few things right, a lot wrong, and yet insisted it was God's Organization,and calls itself the " truth ". After all ,it is easy to find other religions that have got MORE on the "pro" list and less on the con list,so that is no reason to stay.

  The scripture where Paul says "what sharing does light have with darkness?" ( 2Cor 6v14.) kept hammering in my head,and in the end the outrageous claims made by the Governing Body (hiding behind the name F.D. Slave) in effect taking the place of Jesus Christ as Mediator made me feel that it was a DANGEROUS place to be,amongst blasphemers.

  I urge you to do your research,read C.O C by Ray Franz and his second book,use sites like JW Facts and Freeminds and look up old threads on here by using the search facility.

  I wish you all the best on your journey,welcome again,

  Kind regards,

  Wobble
• 

  oompa

  Welcome!.....but i want a pool started on how long it take for you to get a new screen name.........my bet is Aug 22, 09.........

  cause no freakin way you are "in between" my friend......you have doubted for ages on many things......and btw....WT requires ALL OR NUTTIN.........no fence sitters make it.....you are not hot or cold maybe, but "lukewarm is considered like you is considered "cold" anyway......so since you are prob lukewarm you are actually "vomit" and will be treated like it if you start to share your honest thoughts/feelings......even if nothing official happens.....your friends will leave you, and ya...they are not really your friends!!!

  that is what permeates my permafrost so much now......how there is just zero room in WT for "freedom of thought/will/opinion" without punishment of some sort.....that is the ONE thing all cults have in common.........this religion is exactly like a dictatorship............oompa

  just let that soak in.....you CAN NOT express your own opinion without consequences.........now THAT is controlling
• 

  no more kool aid

  Hi, inbetween and welcome. Like the above posters I urge you to read Crisis of Conscience. What really convinced me to leave were the doctrinal flip flops like civil service, blood fractions, homosexuality not being considered adultery, organ transplants etc. "New light" is just great but look at the lives that were just devastated in the meantime. Steve Haasan's books about cult mind control are a must also, still on my night stand after a year for when my family's guilt trips start. I hope this site helps you as I has helped me.
• 

  leftbelow

  First of all welcome. Second you are right at the beginning of a journey sometimes it will be scary and sometime it will make you angry.

  But try not to let it push you too deeply into anger and bitterness. That was the worst part for me. Just lean on the wonderful people here and if you ever need to talk many of us have been through what you are going through.

  So again welcome
• 

  shamus100

  Good day!

  Everyone already said everything I wanted to - just wanted to say welcome.
• 

  Heaven

  Welcome, inbetween! If you have doubts, I don't think you can stay in as you will be in constant conflict. But there are better ways of leaving (ie, the fade) than the chaotic DF and shunning.

  There are many good books with great information in them. Ray Franz's book "Crisis Of Conscience" definitely gave me an excellent view of the Governing Body and confirmed everything I have felt about this organization since I was a teenager (back in the 1970s). I remember the razzing the JWs got from my school buddies when Armageddon was a no-show in 1975.

  I checked out YouTube videos and other websites, including www.jwfacts.com. Steven Hassan, cult expert and exit-counselor has a couple of excellent books as well. Check out his website at www.freedomofmind.com. I am a very big proponent of Stephen Covey's work in "7 Habits of Highly Effective People" and "First Things First".

  Being a woman, I am definitely against the subjugation this group actively carries out towards women . I could never do that to myself. Also, many things just never added up for me over 30 years ago and they still don't. The blood policy was a fabrication of Fred Franz. It didn't exist prior to his presidency. So this policy has been a "Yes/No/Sometimes-Maybe" thing. They used to celebrate Christmas, wear a cross and crown pin and they didn't go door-to-door. Like so many of their beliefs and doctrines, they don't hold up over time and have to change. They are also not Biblical. This tells me they are not from God.

  I see no need to belong to any organized, man-made religion. I have had to tell my JW father a few times that his beliefs are not aligning with the teachings of Jesus Christ. If you focus on good, you will manifest good. I have seen this in all faiths, not just Christians. When you choose to be insular, you become hollow inside. I see the JWs this way, and it saddens me. I hope you can avoid this happening to you.
• 

  Quandry

  Welcome!!!

  You said:

  anyway, I´m now in a rather difficult situation, I have not made my mind up fully, but anyway I cant do anything, because i would , would loose family, friends etc...on the other hand I would probably support a religion, which is (partly) wrong on serious issues....a loose/loose situation actually...

  I am reminded of what a poster had said on this forum when I first came here that impressed me--"I'd rather have questions I can't answer than answers I can't question."

  That has been my feeling ever since. At least you can come here and give "voice" to your concerns. If you do this with anyone at the Hall, at best, they will begin to feel you are "weak" and become wary of you; at worst, they can turn you in to the elders with an accusation of apostacy.

  Please take things slowly and carefully, and do more research. Don't make rash decisions that may have repercussions for you at this time.