My first encounter with JWs at my door in forever

by alpha_1 18 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • alpha_1
    alpha_1

    Hi everyone

    To cut to the chase:

    Last week a woman came to my door and introduced herself. I had been preparing for this for so long. She had the typical condescending attitude with me when I told her I read the bible and that yes I think the bible can be applied in our lives today. She quickly asserted the importance of Jehovah as she read John 17:3 to me. Not caring to debate her since I knew she would not be up to it I asked her if the name of Jehovah was even in the New Testament. She paused for a second and claimed that "Yes it is." I quickly assured her that no it is not but that we have been given the Name of Jesus and that there is no other name by which we are saved. Acts 4:12.

    "You might want to look that up." I cautioned her. At that point I bid her farewell and went about my business.

    Two days later I was approached at my door by an older gentlman and a man in his early twenties. After a brief introduction of himself and his faith, he mentioned his wife and I told him that yes I had met her.

    I decided to take him on. I waited. He made several assertions concerning the great work of the Jehovah's Witnesses and the satanic control over the world and politely agreed with everything he said.

    He even went on to point out that we should care for our enemies and I used that moment to inform him of my ministry and that such scriptures are of great importance for pacifying conflict. I also informed him that for people like ourselves such mildness is simple and that there are people of a certain element that are caught up in struggles that are not so simple and it is those types of people that need to be ministered to the most.

    Once I felt I had estblished my own position and that we were equals I picked a further opportunity to begin the examination of his beliefs. He wanted to pick up where I had left off with his wife so he quickly established his position that Jehovah is God.

    Before he could say anything more I asked him who Jesus is. He stated "We as Jehovah's Witnesses believe that Jesus is the Son of God."

    "So you believe that he is really the literal Son of God."

    "Yes." He said

    "So what do you mean by that?"

    He wasn't sure what to say but he was very careful. I wanted him to say what he really meant and was clearly not interested in saying too many things about Jesus, possibly sensing I was going to trap him.

    I asked him what he was before he came to earth. Again he did not want to be specific so he said again he was the Son of God.

    Maintaining a completely even tone without being visually effected by anything I say or he says I went forward.

    "Is he your Lord?" I asked.

    He got very flustered with that question. He then said many things but would not admit that Jesus is his Lord. He said "Well lord is a title. Jesus is many things he is a wise counselor, a good teacher, the prince of peace, eternal father..."

    "Wonderful counselor, eternal Father, and Mighty God?" I finsished.

    Instead of admitting that Jesus is his lord he walked right into it.

    He paused admitting that what I said is true and the young man with him slowly began dropping his head.

    "So then naturally you believe that he is equal with his father?"

    So I gave him an opportunity. I had previously indicated that the Gospel of John is my favorite book.

    He was pleased to answer that "with a verse from my [sic] favorite book."

    "You heard that I said to you, 'I go away, and I will come to you ' If you loved Me, you would have rejoiced because I go to the Father, for the Father is greater than I." John 14:28

    He was very proud of what he just did so I responded in my usual fashion, "And because they're father and son you believe they are basically equal, right?"

    "No... No" He was shocked that he had no effect on my whatesoever, "a son can never be as great as his father, how can he? He is only a son." He said pleading with me.

    "Is David greater than Jesse?" I asked in the calmest tone possible.

    And he lost it. His arms literally went over his head and he began scrambling and talking about how David was greater in his works and accomplishments and he was desparately thinking for a way out of everything he was now admitting to, so I helped him.

    "But because they are father and son then they are basically equal, right?"

    And he had nothing to say. He was probably 63 years old with 50 years experience and was speechless.

    "Who is the Alpha and the Omega." I asked.

    He just gazed with his head turned slightly sideways and repeated my question afraid to even repeat it. He didn't know what to do. He didn't know what to say. He acted like I was speaking a foreign language.

    "Yes, the Alpha and the Omega, it's in Revelation, you do know what I am talking about right?" I repeated.

    He knew when he was defeated so he didn't take the challenge. He merely stated that it was a two hour debate and he doesn't have the time.

    "It's just two scriptures. It would take 15 seconds."

    He paused again so I decided that opened him up to a flanking maneuver.

    "Tell me something, who is that in Revelation chapter nine that comes out of the bottomless pit in the form of rampaging locusts."

    He paused looking at me from the side.

    "I read your Revelation book. So, who is that." I said. My questions coming slowly and plainly. "Their king is Apollyon the Destroyer, the fallen angel..."

    Here is a guy that is scared to admit what he teaches.

    "Isn't that the Jehovah's Witnesses?" And I gave the account of their bold menacing scorpion activities. A fate worse than death.

    "Well that's the 144,000."

    "Yeah not many of them left are there." I said in a mild, sympathetic tone.

    "No..." He said defeated.

    "I find it very interesting that you can't take the time to read two scriptures that are very relevant and yet you believe such a thing about these scorpion beasts.

    So why is it that you believe that?"

    He knew he had no answer. I was just asking some simple questions. And he couldn't take it.

    By now the young man with him looked drained. The old guy managed to put on a smile and tell me to keep reading my bible. I wanted to tell him to take his own advice but I knew that kid with him would be more affected by what I was already going to say.

    "Ookay? God speed."

    It was awesome.

    When I asked him if David was greater than Jesse, after he set himself up, he looked like I hit him right between the eyes.

  • mrsjones5
    mrsjones5

    I like how you lead him to it and how gentle you were about it. You rock! Welcome to the board.

    Josie

  • BabaYaga
    BabaYaga

    Very nicely done! And welcome to the board.

  • quietlyleaving
    quietlyleaving

    that was excellent, alpha. We have a very judgemental Jehovahs witness on here called Reniaa who keeps defining us as haters and mockers and she never stops - I don't think she'll be able to get past you.

  • alpha_1
    alpha_1

    Quietlyleaving,

    thanks for the props. I probably won't be engaging in any debates though. I am interested in sharing my tactics with people such as yourself for IRL contacts and if you have any ideas about how I can engage JWs in real life I am all ears. I love talking to them. There are few things I find so entertaining. They are the easiest people in the world to preach to. Not kidding.

  • quietlyleaving
    quietlyleaving

    Quietlyleaving,

    thanks for the props. I probably won't be engaging in any debates though. I am interested in sharing my tactics with people such as yourself for IRL contacts and if you have any ideas about how I can engage JWs in real life I am all ears. I love talking to them. There are few things I find so entertaining. They are the easiest people in the world to preach to. Not kidding.

    I'm not sure that you will get much opportunity in real life becasue Jehovahs witnesses have a warning system wherein they make a note of homes where they have been defeated and advise the group to avoid engaging those ones in conversation.

  • passwordprotected
    passwordprotected

    Great stuff, welcome to the board.

  • yesidid
    yesidid
    I'm not sure that you will get much opportunity in real life becasue Jehovahs witnesses have a warning system wherein they make a note of homes where they have been defeated and advise the group to avoid engaging those ones in conversation.

    How does that warning system work?

  • yesidid
    yesidid

    alpha_1

    I was just wondering what you were trying to prove or accomplish?

    yesidid

  • alanv
    alanv

    Welcome to the board Alpha 1. I applaud you taking this guy on but I do think you would have got different answers from a more mature witness.

    There are many scriptures that call Jesus the son of God so that would cause no concern to them

    The scripture says the father is greater than I am. That is exactly what witnesses believe. Jehovah the creator and is greater than his son

    Your point on Jesse proves nothing. There are many sons who are greater than their father and vice versa

    The Alpha and the Omege means the beginning and the end. A witness will tell you that Jesus was the beginning and end of all creation

    The point on Apollyon is that these days the Watchtower teaches that this applies to Jesus, and the locusts are the 144000 spreading the kingdom message.

    Although the scripture calls Jesus a might god the witnesses would say yes he is a mighty god but not the ALmighty God. After all you could call Satan a mighty god. He does have mighty power as does Jesus

    Having said all that there are many ways to show the Watchtower is a false prophet and it is great you want to expose them.

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